2019 BOA Grand National Championships

[Samuel Culper]

If cost isn't the issue, then why don't the Texas Heavy Hitters go to Grand nats every year? Not trying to be a jerk here.

I don't think anybody is claiming cost isn't an issue for Texas bands to go to GNats. What LeanderMomma is saying is that cost is not the reason why fewer non-Texas heavy hitters are going to GNats this year vs other years.

[TWHSParent]

If cost isn't the issue, then why don't the Texas Heavy Hitters go to Grand nats every year? Not trying to be a jerk here.

 

I don't read her comment as stating cost isn't an issue. I think what she was stating is that cost is no more and no less of an issue than it always is, as nothing has dramatically increased in price this year over last. So with the cost issue neutral, what is the real driving item (or items) for the relative lack of attendees? It could be a ROI evaluation by those marginal finals or semi-finals bands, and they determined their resources are better spent elsewhere due to the very strong TX contingent likely eliminating available spots. We certainly don't know, but we can absolutely speculate.

[LeanderMomma]

If cost isn't the issue, then why don't the Texas Heavy Hitters go to Grand nats every year? Not trying to be a jerk here.

Because that WOULD get rather expensive. And we have that whole UIL thing happening every other year. I’m just bummed that we go on non UIL years, and the other bands that I would dearly love to see, bands that do normally attend GN by the way, are choosing to skip this year. Like I mentioned before, many of those same bands who normally choose to attend Grand Nats have chosen to do the Indy Super this year instead. And I don’t remember seeing any Texas bands on the list to attend that one.

[CTJBandPops]

Because that WOULD get rather expensive. And we have that whole UIL thing happening every other year. I’m just bummed that we go on non UIL years, and the other bands that I would dearly love to see, bands that do normally attend GN by the way, are choosing to skip this year. Like I mentioned before, many of those same bands who normally choose to attend Grand Nats have chosen to do the Indy Super this year instead. And I don’t remember seeing any Texas bands on the list to attend that one. ‍♀

I get your point - it is expensive for TX Bands to make the trip, but this year it would appear that many of the bands that normally attend - at a much lower cost, as they are closer to Indy are not making the trip - this is one of the smallest fields I have seen in the past 8+ years attending GNats 

 

is it because of the Texas Bands that will be there? these are some big hitters that can dominate the top half of the finals and take some medals

[Jeffrey L. Gorman]

I think one of the little talked about reasons for many Bands not going to Grand Nationals this year is very simple. Many of the state education folks have bought into having their own regional Marching contests and in some cases, their own state events. For example, Ohio has a lot of good Bands, but not many are at GNC. Ohio now has a State Marching championship contest which has become more important because of the emphasis of recognizing THE BEST BANDS IN OHIO.  Interestingly enough, their State Contest is strictly ratings. 

 

This is just one of many situations, which has came about because the NATIONAL FEDERATION of STATE HS ASSOCIATIONS is trying to make it easy for each state to have Marching Contest.  If you go to the NFSHS Web site you will see that they have their own approved copies of score sheets and rules for contests. I know that the Iowa High School Music Association(IHSMA) now has a state Marching Contest which all schools approve of. It is similar to UIL Region Contest with all Bands Performing strictly for Ratings. This is also being done in Michigan, PA, and numerous other states in the East. 

 

The fact of the matter is, we are the unique state in this nation. We not only spend more money on our Bands and let me say this for all of you who are so critical of your school districts support for Band.  TEXAS SCHOOLS DO NOT LIKE BEING TOLD THAT HAVING A ONE SIZE FITS ALL MARCHING CONTEST SYSTEM ACROSS THE COUNTRY, WE TEND TO KNOW WHAT WE WANT.   It has been far to easy for many states school systems to be glad that they have a MARCHING FESTIVAL, OR CONTEST THAT EVERY ONE IS HAPPY WITH. Lets face it is not OUR CONCERT BAND System based on the Rating system type of operation.  There will always be Bands who want to attend GNC, however let u s have no illusion that other states think like we co.

[LeanderMomma]

[DrumCorpsGeek]

I think one of the little talked about reasons for many Bands not going to Grand Nationals this year is very simple. Many of the state education folks have bought into having their own regional Marching contests and in some cases, their own state events. For example, Ohio has a lot of good Bands, but not many are at GNC. Ohio now has a State Marching championship contest which has become more important because of the emphasis of recognizing THE BEST BANDS IN OHIO.  Interestingly enough, their State Contest is strictly ratings. 

 

This is just one of many situations, which has came about because the NATIONAL FEDERATION of STATE HS ASSOCIATIONS is trying to make it easy for each state to have Marching Contest.  If you go to the NFSHS Web site you will see that they have their own approved copies of score sheets and rules for contests. I know that the Iowa High School Music Association(IHSMA) now has a state Marching Contest which all schools approve of. It is similar to UIL Region Contest with all Bands Performing strictly for Ratings. This is also being done in Michigan, PA, and numerous other states in the East. 

 

The fact of the matter is, we are the unique state in this nation. We not only spend more money on our Bands and let me say this for all of you who are so critical of your school districts support for Band.  TEXAS SCHOOLS DO NOT LIKE BEING TOLD THAT HAVING A ONE SIZE FITS ALL MARCHING CONTEST SYSTEM ACROSS THE COUNTRY, WE TEND TO KNOW WHAT WE WANT.   It has been far to easy for many states school systems to be glad that they have a MARCHING FESTIVAL, OR CONTEST THAT EVERY ONE IS HAPPY WITH. Lets face it is not OUR CONCERT BAND System based on the Rating system type of operation.  There will always be Bands who want to attend GNC, however let u s have no illusion that other states think like we co.

As someone who lives in PA, what is the circuit being run?  PIMBA?

 

(sorry to go off the main topic)

[TWHSParent]

It may not be as bad as we think. Of the "local" powerhouse bands, they are attending - Carmel, Avon, Homestead, William Mason, and Marian Catholic (I don't put Castle there yet as they need a few more years of high performing, although they aren't attending in 2019 so far). Union is attending, as is Harrison (lets see if they can recover and challenge in class AAA). With Round Rock, The Woodlands, Leander, and Claudia Taylor Johnson, those 11 have all been in GN finals during the past 4 years.

 

For other (non TX) recent finalists, it appears that BA is on a rotation year (2 on, 1 off), Tarpon Springs is also on a rotation (every other year). Blue Springs may be developing a rotation, as they have attended 3 of the last 4 years. Wando looks to be on an every other year rotation. Dobyns-Bennett has attended many years in a row (and 3 consecutive finals appearances), but there may be another reason for them to miss. Jenks and O'Fallon Township are also skipping this year.

 

By my count there have been 26 different finalists the last 4 years. 11 of those are attending in 2019, but only 4 returning from 2018.

 

As to the depth of the field, it is hard to say. Cost can certainly be an issue, as well as the competitive landscape. Perhaps it is cheaper to attend the Indy Super Regional than Grand Nationals? Or maybe the dates are too late this year? Or perhaps a bit of a return to normalcy in the number of attendees? 108 is really starting to push the boundaries of capacity, and I think that semi-finals has become too large. When the first band goes on at 6 or 7 am, that is too early!

 

Anyway, my quick read of the current field leave me with 18 bands that I think could be in finals:

Avon, IN

Ayala, CA

Carmel, IN

Center Grove, IN

Centerville, OH

Claudia Taylor Johnson, TX

Harrison, GA

Hebron, TX

Homestead, IN
Leander, TX

Marian Catholic, IL

North Hardin, KY

Park Vista, FL

Round Rock, TX

The Woodlands, TX

Union, OK

Vandegrift, TX

William Mason, OH

 

There certainly could be surprises too, but I anticipate the 12 finalists will come from that group. And it certainly is not a bad group by any means!

[Jeffrey L. Gorman]

As someone who lives in PA, what is the circuit being run?  PIMBA?

 

(sorry to go off the main topic)

Here is how it works. The PIAA Pennsylvania Interscholastic Association is a member of National Federation of High Schools. PIMBA, which serves Bands in Western PA is aligned with PIAA. If you will look at Article 6 in the By Laws, they talk about Festival or Rated Bands and how they are to be judged. Going further PIMBA started doing exhibition Contests (for Ratings) in 2004.   Apparently more and more High School Bands want the Festival Ratings for their contests.   For those of you in Eastern PA, the Tournament of Bands Circuit now are offering Rated Marching Festivals.  Interestingly enough, the Cavalcade of Bands does not provide this service. I guess both PIMBA and TOB had contact with PIAA.  It would seem that the Festival Ratings are becoming more popular in schools in PA, but not the majority at this time.

[LeanderMomma]

I would love to see more Texas bands attending non San Antonio super regionals. We seem to just stick with SA and GN for the most part. Maybe one year a big chunk of us can do Indy supers over GN.

[Jeffrey L. Gorman]

I would love to see more Texas bands attending non San Antonio super regionals. We seem to just stick with SA and GN for the most part. Maybe one year a big chunk of us can do Indy supers over GN.

The Big problems are two fold.  Most of the out of state contests are held on weekends in Oct, which is a conflict with the majority of Bands in the State having UIL Regional  Marching contests on the Saturdays in question. The Indy Super Region conflicts with the weekend UIL Area Contests and I know of no administrations that would allow a Band to miss a UIL Contest for any BOA Event.  2. Football. Grand Nationals are after the Regular Season has ended so school administrators would have fewer reasons to complain about a Band missing a Football Game(which they had no knowledge of until the season ended).   ADD on Homecomings which makes a long trip during that weekend unpopular with Officials and to be honest probably a fair amount of the Bands. 

 

We just have to work with the situation we have. I think we should encourage Bands to go to other states, however that is not going to be supported to the same level as going to San Antonio in the First week of Nov. 

[LeanderMomma]

The Big problems are two fold. Most of the out of state contests are held on weekends in Oct, which is a conflict with the majority of Bands in the State having UIL Regional Marching contests on the Saturdays in question. The Indy Super Region conflicts with the weekend UIL Area Contests and I know of no administrations that would allow a Band to miss a UIL Contest for any BOA Event. 2. Football. Grand Nationals are after the Regular Season has ended so school administrators would have fewer reasons to complain about a Band missing a Football Game(which they had no knowledge of until the season ended). ADD on Homecomings which makes a long trip during that weekend unpopular with Officials and to be honest probably a fair amount of the Bands.

 

We just have to work with the situation we have. I think we should encourage Bands to go to other states, however that is not going to be supported to the same level as going to San Antonio in the First week of Nov.

Yeah, it’s just a pipe dream I know.

[BlueCircle]

Hebron is really like the Carolina Crown of BOA right now. Best brass in the game and difficult drill. But a weak visual design holds them back in GE. And while their guard is good, they don’t demand your attention.

 

And CTJ kind of reminds of the Blue Coats. Probably the most innovative and forward-thinking band in Texas currently. However, I am very skeptical about the idea of doing a sequel show especially trying to do a sequel to the highest scoring super regional show of all time. When bands or drum corps try to recreate the magic of a previous show it rarely plays in their favor. Broken Arrow’s 2017 show just didn’t have the same effect that the original had in 2016. Carolina Crown’s show in 2014 wasn’t a direct sequel to 2013 but it borrowed a lot and also didn’t have the same effect. I desperately want CTJ to prove me wrong but I think trying to recreate magic mostly leads to disappointment.

[SATXBandDad]

Hebron is really like the Carolina Crown of BOA right now. Best brass in the game and difficult drill. But a weak visual design holds them back in GE. And while their guard is good, they don’t demand your attention.

 

And CTJ kind of reminds of the Blue Coats. Probably the most innovative and forward-thinking band in Texas currently. However, I am very skeptical about the idea of doing a sequel show especially trying to do a sequel to the highest scoring super regional show of all time. When bands or drum corps try to recreate the magic of a previous show it rarely plays in their favor. Broken Arrow’s 2017 show just didn’t have the same effect that the original had in 2016. Carolina Crown’s show in 2014 wasn’t a direct sequel to 2013 but it borrowed a lot and also didn’t have the same effect. I desperately want CTJ to prove me wrong but I think trying to recreate magic mostly leads to disappointment.

Don’t fret. I was a bit concerned too but so very little of the show is connected to the 2017 show. Get ready for “The Circle of Life”!!! #inLipmanwetrust, #wehaveaLipman

[LeanderMomma]

Don’t fret. I was a bit concerned too but so very little of the show is connected to the 2017 show. Get ready for “The Circle of Life”!!! #inLipmanwetrust, #wehaveaLipman

Ha, I love your hashtags.

 

I can’t wait to see CTJ bring us OH I Just Can’t Wait to be King! on the football field. Will there be a Simba? Scar? Mufasa?!! So excited to see what the uniforms will look like too. Bring it Johnson Jaguar Band!!

[LeanderMomma]

Hebron is really like the Carolina Crown of BOA right now. Best brass in the game and difficult drill. But a weak visual design holds them back in GE. And while their guard is good, they don’t demand your attention.

 

And CTJ kind of reminds of the Blue Coats. Probably the most innovative and forward-thinking band in Texas currently. However, I am very skeptical about the idea of doing a sequel show especially trying to do a sequel to the highest scoring super regional show of all time. When bands or drum corps try to recreate the magic of a previous show it rarely plays in their favor. Broken Arrow’s 2017 show just didn’t have the same effect that the original had in 2016. Carolina Crown’s show in 2014 wasn’t a direct sequel to 2013 but it borrowed a lot and also didn’t have the same effect. I desperately want CTJ to prove me wrong but I think trying to recreate magic mostly leads to disappointment.

My BBMF (best band mom friend) and I were comparing Texas bands to DCI just yesterday. (This isn’t you, is it Janice? ) We also compared Hebron to Crown, same as you. Because the lush brass sound from each is so similar. And that CTJ is very Bluecoats like. I found Blue Devils show a lot like the stuff Leander does. And SCV reminded us of FloMo. It was just interesting to compare them and to see so many similarities between DCI and some of the top Texas groups.

[Vidal28]

 

My BBMF (best band mom friend) and I were comparing Texas bands to DCI just yesterday. (This isn’t you, is it Janice? ) We also compared Hebron to Crown, same as you. Because the lush brass sound from each is so similar. And that CTJ is very Bluecoats like. I found Blue Devils show a lot like the stuff Leander does. And SCV reminded us of FloMo. It was just interesting to compare them and to see so many similarities between DCI and some of the top Texas groups.

One comparison my friends have in the past, being in high school band in DFW, despite the dominance of Flo Mo and the awe-inspiring shows from Hebron musically, the one band a lot of groups probably didn’t wanna see was Marcus. they probably had the most BD vibe, not in their style, but just the aura of dominance and consistency they bring every year, a band that the very best in the state can lose to on any given day(being that band more often than not)which showed in their 5-peat of UIL and many contests over the years, even though they’ve lost a bit of that dominance over the past few years they still always can pull out a win at any contest

[LeanderMomma]

One comparison my friends have in the past, being in high school band in DFW, despite the dominance of Flo Mo and the awe-inspiring shows from Hebron musically, the one band a lot of groups probably didn’t wanna see was Marcus. they probably had the most BD vibe, not in their style, but just the aura of dominance and consistency they bring every year, a band that the very best in the state can lose to on any given day(being that band more often than not)which showed in their 5-peat of UIL and many contests over the years, even though they’ve lost a bit of that dominance over the past few years they still always can pull out a win at any contest

We actually talked about that too and said that Marcus is similar to SCV. Big props, big sound, and sometimes they surprise everyone and hit a home run.

[BlueCircle]

I would love to see The Woodlands return to the top this year. Every few years they come out with a show that is absolutely spectacular (2013,2016...hmm maybe there’s a 3 year pattern forming).

[principalagent]

I would love to see The Woodlands return to the top this year. Every few years they come out with a show that is absolutely spectacular (2013,2016...hmm maybe there’s a 3 year pattern forming).

I loved their 2018 show and thought it was dramatically underscored in visual and GE come the end of the season. Hoping whatever they do this fall clicks with the judges.

[LeanderMomma]

I loved their 2018 show and thought it was dramatically underscored in visual and GE come the end of the season. Hoping whatever they do this fall clicks with the judges.

I agree. I had them picked for much closer to the top in San Antonio last fall. Like in 2016 I think it was when they took the silver. I think...

 

I am oh so hopeful that all of Team Texas has a banner year this year.

[gmtb617]

 

My BBMF (best band mom friend) and I were comparing Texas bands to DCI just yesterday. (This isn’t you, is it Janice? ) We also compared Hebron to Crown, same as you. Because the lush brass sound from each is so similar. And that CTJ is very Bluecoats like. I found Blue Devils show a lot like the stuff Leander does. And SCV reminded us of FloMo. It was just interesting to compare them and to see so many similarities between DCI and some of the top Texas groups.

I noticed that the Blue Devils 2019 and Vista Ridge 2018 had one common piece of source music between them. Not sure the name of the piece but it reaffirms the thought of comparing a Leander ISD school to the Blue Devils for sure.

 

I also agree with your other comparisons. Although maybe for FloMo - SCV the comparison factor is amplified bc they both have white uniforms.

[LeanderMomma]

I noticed that the Blue Devils 2019 and Vista Ridge 2018 had one common piece of source music between them. Not sure the name of the piece but it reaffirms the thought of comparing a Leander ISD school to the Blue Devils for sure.

 

I also agree with your other comparisons. Although maybe for FloMo - SCV the comparison factor is amplified bc they both have white uniforms.

I noticed the VR music in the BD show as well. I liked it a lot in both groups!

 

SCV reminded me of FloMo with their crazy props rolling all over the field, their fierce trumpets and the general melee that surrounds the show.

 

Edit: I meant melee in a good way BTW. Don’t want to get blasted for saying FloMo is a mass of confusion on the field!! It’s a controlled mass of confusion.

[Grace]

I noticed the VR music in the BD show as well. I liked it a lot in both groups!

 

SCV reminded me of FloMo with their crazy props rolling all over the field, their fierce trumpets and the general melee that surrounds the show.

 

Edit: I meant melee in a good way BTW. Don’t want to get blasted for saying FloMo is a mass of confusion on the field!! It’s a controlled mass of confusion.

 

I believe the Vista Ridge Lost and Found music that similar with the Blue Devils 2019 is the Cycle Song from Imogen Heap.  It's a really fun song with great energy!

 

Here is the U-Tube link to her song:  

[TWHSParent]

I loved their 2018 show and thought it was dramatically underscored in visual and GE come the end of the season. Hoping whatever they do this fall clicks with the judges.

 

I think the judges in general don't "get" shows that are science oriented. I really, really liked James Bowie's show last year, and to me it did an outstanding job of presenting itself, and made a strong statement. However, the judges didn't get it from what I can tell, and the scores showed that. The same with TWHS the last 2 years. The shows that dive into pop culture or into reviews of artistic figures resonate much better with the judges, as those topics are very much what they know and have been exposed to. Just my take, and I'm sure there are counter-examples (and I don't mean BA's Return to Xeno - they went into 50's pop sci-fi mode with the purple wigs etc.)