2010 UIL State

[mrwood69]

With all do respect, how do you define "good?" Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm assuming you mean "entertaining" instead of "good." Marching at 172 can be incredibly entertaining for an audience, especially if executed very well. However, fast marching is not always necessarily "good." Do you happen to know what Marcus' fastest tempo was in their last two gold-medal-winning shows? I'm a huge Marcus fan and I think that fast marching has absolutely nothing to do with the accolades they are collecting...

 

 

Entertaining, energetic, etc. IMO marching band should be an energetic activity (like DCI). Leave the concert music for concert season. Marcus' tempos were probably like 20 or some super slow ****.

Edited October 26, 2010 by mrwood69

[TxRaider13]

Why is everyone ranking the Woodlands so low? I don't get it..

 

 

Some factors are the Woodlands are a BOA style band, which doesn't rank well with UIL. Now another is the judges, and all it takes is 1 judge to mess up the rankings. Another thing is look at the bands that people have in finals. It doesn't matter if they are playing "fan" music or old school music. The schools that march clean at a slow tempo and play clean will always out place the fast pace semi-clean music and drill, because thats how the UIL works. BOA is a different beast that rewards to a degree the harder drill and music with visuals.

 

I like the Woodlands and hope they do well, and I look forward to seeing them perform as I do wish the same to all the schools.

[flute]

With all do respect, how do you define "good?" Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm assuming you mean "entertaining" instead of "good." Marching at 172 can be incredibly entertaining for an audience, especially if executed very well. However, fast marching is not always necessarily "good." Do you happen to know what Marcus' fastest tempo was in their last two gold-medal-winning shows? I'm a huge Marcus fan and I think that fast marching has absolutely nothing to do with the accolades they are collecting...

 

I agree completely. Like I think somebody mentioned before, a lot of the bigger 5A bands are working to appeal to the judges rather than the casual observer. The slower parts can be the ones that show off a band's overall tone. With practice, it's not that difficult to play and march at a fast tempo. But with even MORE practice, you can develop a glorious brass or woodwind sound.

 

Also, I think it's difficult for bands to have "big" moments in their music, the kind that will win them state, if their ENTIRE show is fast paced and "exciting".

[Xenon]

Make sure to do your research before making a comment. They made UIL state finals in 2002 and 2004....for the older members and maybe Danpod; "Taco Tuba" should be familiar. Note: 2002 was prelims only due to inclement weather in Waco, so they finished in the top ten, hence similar to making it into finals.

UIL State didn't start taking 10 into Finals until 2004.

 

1981-1995 = 5 to Finals

1996-2003 = 7 to Finals

2004-present = 7 to Finals if there are 20 or fewer bands in Prelims. 10 to Finals if there are at least 21 bands in Prelims.

[sax_man 2007]

UIL State didn't start taking 10 into Finals until 2004.

 

1981-1995 = 5 to Finals

1996-2003 = 7 to Finals

2004-present = 7 to Finals if there are 20 or fewer bands in Prelims. 10 to Finals if there are at least 21 bands in Prelims.

 

Thanks for the info! I was wondering if you had any new information on how the live video feed would work out? Will it be similar to the MFA fannetwork or something different?

[Xenon]

Thanks for the info! I was wondering if you had any new information on how the live video feed would work out? Will it be similar to the MFA fannetwork or something different?

 

They still haven't released any information about it other than that they will have one.....

[Clarinet_Lover41]

I am kind of excited I really look forward to seeing who steps up... I think it will be interesting to see if Hebron can do anything after their area performance, I think it will be a great showing and some amazing bands will get left out of finals.

[ace69044]

180+ is where its at

[thetrumpetlife2010]

Don't get me wrong, Haltom is great, but i was surprised to see them advance to state. Even getting alternate would have surprised me. Their show just isn't up to par with where they have been. BUT, they are still a great band. Personally, I thought it'd be Marcus, Bell, Richland and Plano East with Hebron and Mansfield as alternates. SO, basically, i'm saying i would be quite surprised if they pulled off finals.

 

All I'm saying is anything can happen. Its anyones game. I don't like how everyone expects L.D. Bell and Marcus to take the top two. (not that I'm saying they aren't good cause they are great)

[whitewing09]

When it comes to Coppell, there is also something to be said about tradition and consistency. I'm not sure how long you've followed band in the state of Texas, but there are a handful of programs that have been consistent finalists at UIL contests for the last decade or two. In my opinion, these bands (Coppell, Duncanville, Bell, etc) are successful each year because they stick to a formula that works for their respective bands. For Coppell, the formula has ALWAYS been music first. It's director places a HUGE importance on music, especially at the individual level (Coppell consistently is one of the top 5As that sends the most individuals to All-State, State Solo, etc.). When it comes to marching band, Coppell sticks to traditional composers and pieces resonate more with the trained ear (such as adjudicators and seasoned band vets) rather than with the typical band "fan" in the stands. Over the years Coppell brings the sounds of Dvorak, Bernstein, Shostakovich, Barber, Hindemith, Holst, Copland, etc. to the field. NEVER will you watch a Coppell (at least not until its current director retires) band play original Poulan, Higginbotham, etc. music. You'll NEVER hear Coppell pull out Cirque du Soleil on the field. I mean this with absolutely no disrespect to other bands who play original music... I happen to love many of those bands. However, it's just not what Coppell's "formula" is....

 

With regards to drill, guard, and overall design... Coppell has really stuck to a same "formula" in that department too. You'll see a bit slower drill as compared to other bands. You'll see a lot of rotating blocks, a lot of follow-the-leader sets. I would say that the Coppell shows in the last 3-4 years have had a bit more innovative drill, but it is still reminiscent of the Coppell in the early 2000s. Even this year's drill, from my observation, is nothing too difficult but it is executed cleanly and performed well.

 

And at the end of the day... that is what Coppell's staff and students shoot for... strong music and marching performed cleanly. I'll be honest, incredible creativity (a la Flower Mound Marcus, a band that I am a huge fan of) has never been Coppell's forte. Perhaps Coppell 2008 (Planets) and Coppell 1999 (New World) were the two shows that came closest to capturing an overarching theme that was evident in both the music, drill, auxiliary work, etc. But Coppell doesn't care about all that... they do what they do and they do it pretty darn well. This is why Coppell was a state finalist every year when they were in 4A. This is why Coppell is a consistent finalist in 5A (let's not talk about 2002-2003 when they were in Area B... whole other can of worms there.) I guess my point is, I don't see them changing that formula any time soon... and they shouldn't.

 

This brings forth the question, "what is the purpose of marching band ?" Coppell's shows appeal to the trained ear rather than the fans, but is that what they should really be pursuing?I was under the impression that band's play to entertain, if they win at competitions, then that's awesome, but to have a show geared solely towards the judge kind of bothers me.

 

It's evident bands can be entertaining and successful. Look at the top bands, most compete and succeed on the BOA and UIL. It's definitely possible, so I don't understand why a band would jeopardize entertainment for a judge-pleasing show. Look at the last 5A state year, the intersection between BOA SA and State Finals was Bell, Marcus, Cedar Park, Bowie, Westlake, Churchill, Hebron, then Richland is usual a more BOA oriented band, and Berkner missed State Finals by one place.

 

At the end of the day, congrats to the students for their hard work. At the same time, the band might receive critic for their director's choice in shows.

[Yoursong]

Yeah well think about it- if you were told at the last minute that this was your only shot to get into state, you'd be nervous and not do as well because of nerves.

 

 

As I told my children, it might have mattered to them Saturday night what their placement was, but come Sunday morning, that slate is wiped clean and its a whole new ballgame. So, I'm happy with the outcome at 5A. I really felt that they should have stopped the competition after Rowlett got off the field and before Duncanville went on the field. Very dangerous, especially with that huge radio tower right next to the football field! It started raining exactly at the time Rowlett's drum majors instructed horns up and rained even harder (with lightening, for Duncanville's show). Hebron, Duncanville and Berkner are some of my favorite bands--glad they made it. I wish all 3A's and 5A's great success in San Antonio next week.

[ilovepirates416]

This brings forth the question, "what is the purpose of marching band ?" Coppell's shows appeal to the trained ear rather than the fans, but is that what they should really be pursuing?I was under the impression that band's play to entertain, if they win at competitions, then that's awesome, but to have a show geared solely towards the judge kind of bothers me.

 

It's evident bands can be entertaining and successful. Look at the top bands, most compete and succeed on the BOA and UIL. It's definitely possible, so I don't understand why a band would jeopardize entertainment for a judge-pleasing show. Look at the last 5A state year, the intersection between BOA SA and State Finals was Bell, Marcus, Cedar Park, Bowie, Westlake, Churchill, Hebron, then Richland is usual a more BOA oriented band, and Berkner missed State Finals by one place.

 

At the end of the day, congrats to the students for their hard work. At the same time, the band might receive critic for their director's choice in shows.

 

"Is that really what they should be pursuing?" You mean, should they should be focusing on entertaining the crowd rather than becoming better musicians overall? Coppell has ALWAYS been about building its students to become the best musicians possible, and I personally think that's what's important in the long run. They don't care about the crowd, they care about bettering the students which is what high school band should always be about. At least, that's my personal belief.

[Yoursong]

This brings forth the question, "what is the purpose of marching band ?" Coppell's shows appeal to the trained ear rather than the fans, but is that what they should really be pursuing?I was under the impression that band's play to entertain, if they win at competitions, then that's awesome, but to have a show geared solely towards the judge kind of bothers me.

 

It's evident bands can be entertaining and successful. Look at the top bands, most compete and succeed on the BOA and UIL. It's definitely possible, so I don't understand why a band would jeopardize entertainment for a judge-pleasing show. Look at the last 5A state year, the intersection between BOA SA and State Finals was Bell, Marcus, Cedar Park, Bowie, Westlake, Churchill, Hebron, then Richland is usual a more BOA oriented band, and Berkner missed State Finals by one place.

 

At the end of the day, congrats to the students for their hard work. At the same time, the band might receive critic for their director's choice in shows.

 

Where's the "Like" button? Oh, yeah, this isn't Facebook. Bottom line (in my opinion), was it a learning experience for all and did the kids enjoy it? Did they put their best foot forward? And, they should never make excuses for their shortcomings. Just do the best you can and enjoy it. There's so many lessons the kids can learn. I love the fact that each band has a "personality" and while I understand the judging, I do prefer the entertainment factor. Another thing the kids get from bands is the relationships. Rowlett kids went back to Mesquite after the postponement and stuck together to watch the remaining bands perform and patiently waited (lol!) hear the ratings. It was cool to see how they interacted with everyone. They even cheered for the other bands. Kudos to Garland HS (it was their homecoming dance night, so you know kids had a lot on their minds). They did very well. Berkner was awesome!

[rcb05]

"Is that really what they should be pursuing?" You mean, should they should be focusing on entertaining the crowd rather than becoming better musicians overall? Coppell has ALWAYS been about building its students to become the best musicians possible, and I personally think that's what's important in the long run. They don't care about the crowd, they care about bettering the students which is what high school band should always be about. At least, that's my personal belief.

 

You took the words right out of my mouth. If your goal is furthering the muscal education of your students, is it better to play Mahler, Respighi and Dvorak, or Mark Higganbotham? I know personally, I had never heard of Dmitri Shostakovich until we (Duncanville) did a Shostakovich show in 1998. He soon became my favorite composer, and I sought out and enjoyed dozens of other works of his simply because I first heard his music on the marching field.

[whitewing09]

"Is that really what they should be pursuing?" You mean, should they should be focusing on entertaining the crowd rather than becoming better musicians overall? Coppell has ALWAYS been about building its students to become the best musicians possible, and I personally think that's what's important in the long run. They don't care about the crowd, they care about bettering the students which is what high school band should always be about. At least, that's my personal belief.

 

You misconstrued my point. I was arguing that Coppell should consider entertaining the crowd rather than pleasing the judge. You seem to make a connection that entertain the crowd can't challenge the students and make them better musicians. Is this necessarily true? No, the other top bands not only challenge their musicians with difficult music and drill, but also entertain the crowd. I think bands should strive to both entertain the public and challenge there students, not challenge their students and please the judges.

[HechYeah08]

You misconstrued my point. I was arguing that Coppell should consider entertaining the crowd rather than pleasing the judge. You seem to make a connection that entertain the crowd can't challenge the students and make them better musicians. Is this necessarily true? No, the other top bands not only challenge their musicians with difficult music and drill, but also entertain the crowd. I think bands should strive to both entertain the public and challenge there students, not challenge their students and please the judges.

 

Your post, however, seems to suggest that coppell's shows are not entertaining to the crowd. If you believe that is the case, then that is your personal opinion and it should be respected. I would argue, though, that "entertainment" is awfully subjective. While you may not find Coppell's shows entertaining, others might.

 

And I must point out that I think you misunderstood my earlier post. If all you took out of it was that Coppell only aims to please the judges with its musical selections, then you missed the message. Coppell, much like another poster mentioned about Duncanville, tends to play musical choices from classical composers. In the end, Coppell takes pride in looking back and equipping its students with a classic repertoire of Shostakovich, Elgar, Hindemith, etc. And don't for a second think that the students don't enjoy this music... If they didn't then there would not be 350+ members each year. Same goes for Duncanville. The kids love what they do, they get to play amazing classical pieces, and they DO have an audience that is truly "entertained" by what they do. To suggest otherwise is to not appreciate the true value and emphasis that Coppell and other similar programs place on music education.

[Parkwoodmom]

I would disagree with you on the "NEVER" part. You are forgetting their The Woodlands' 2006 BOA AAA Championship year where they received the Outstanding Visual Caption at BOA San Antonio, beating out Bell and Marcus in visual performance.

 

And was class champ after semis at Grand Nats, too!

[sax_man 2007]

And was class champ after semis at Grand Nats, too!

 

Yes, that's what the "2006 BOA AAA Championship" meant.

[whitewing09]

Your post, however, seems to suggest that coppell's shows are not entertaining to the crowd. If you believe that is the case, then that is your personal opinion and it should be respected. I would argue, though, that "entertainment" is awfully subjective. While you may not find Coppell's shows entertaining, others might.

 

And I must point out that I think you misunderstood my earlier post. If all you took out of it was that Coppell only aims to please the judges with its musical selections, then you missed the message. Coppell, much like another poster mentioned about Duncanville, tends to play musical choices from classical composers. In the end, Coppell takes pride in looking back and equipping its students with a classic repertoire of Shostakovich, Elgar, Hindemith, etc. And don't for a second think that the students don't enjoy this music... If they didn't then there would not be 350+ members each year. Same goes for Duncanville. The kids love what they do, they get to play amazing classical pieces, and they DO have an audience that is truly "entertained" by what they do. To suggest otherwise is to not appreciate the true value and emphasis that Coppell and other similar programs place on music education.

 

My post reflects the content of your post, you brought forth the argument that Coppell chooses music that is more entertaining to those with a "train" ear rather than the "typical band fan". Considering that their audience will usually be "typical band fans" I think they should aim towards that audience if it doesn't already. I happened to love Coppell's 2008 show and I haven't had the opportunity to see any others, so I don't really have an opinion on them besides thinking that they're on the of top UIL bands. If they're happy with what they do then good for them.

[TxRaider13]

Whats with all the hate/love with Coppell? We have plenty of other schools we could talk about.

[Danpod]

Whats with all the hate/love with Coppell? We have plenty of other schools we could talk about.

 

I think Berkner should do quite well on Tuesday. This seems like their best product in years and I personally root for any program with Frank Troyka attached to it.

[sotwtuba]

Whats with all the hate/love with Coppell? We have plenty of other schools we could talk about.

 

I think this could be the year an El Paso band finally breaks into finals.

[Danpod]

I think this could be the year an El Paso band finally breaks into finals.

 

Yours, right?

[mellopwn1]

I think I am going to wait until at least Saturday to make any rash predictions. I don't feel like I have seen the bands or studied there shows enough to make an educated decision on how they will rank.

 

That's my opinion.

Edited October 27, 2010 by mellopwn1

[mrwood69]

Who predicts what band will get last?! lololololol k