Texas 4A Area C 2025 marching band predictions.

[TexasStrangers]

18 minutes ago, bandisfun2000 said:

Took a look at the recap. Although I can’t say much since I’m not a judge I am curious of what Chuck Moon’s thoughts were in finals. Especially with lumberton in 12th for music.. 

Edit: Just saw that he also ranked SS 10th  and Farmersville 15th in music for prelims. Now I’m really curious on his thoughts.

Not to mention Chuck gave PG a 2 in Prelims then turned around and gave them a 9 in Finals which you could argue cost PG a trip to state. They tied Canton for 6th but Canton had a 4th Place Vote and got the tie breaker. 

[SETXgal]

We noticed that 2 judges are different than the judges that were listed on the program. It still had the Lindale date, so I think they had already been printed. So, I guess the date change caused them to need 2 substitute judges? Grant & Andre.

And, Canton & Pleasant Grove tied for 6th in finals. 

[J-Mike16]

20 minutes ago, bandisfun2000 said:

Took a look at the recap. Although I can’t say much since I’m not a judge I am curious of what Chuck Moon’s thoughts were in finals. Especially with lumberton in 12th for music.. 

Edit: Just saw that he also ranked SS 10th  and Farmersville 15th in music for prelims. Now I’m really curious on his thoughts.

I watched videos of Lumberton's prelims and finals runs, and definitely thought their music was better on the 2nd run. Also this may just be me, but I thought the reason why Lumberton placed in 8th was because of nerves. 

[Gpk1968]

IMO, Chuck has a reputation for some interesting scoring. 

 

ive heard him give some really good feedback but sometimes his rankings leave me scratching my head. 
 

that being said, i know im not an expert and I respect their experience and expertise. I’m sure there’s a rhyme to his reason. 

[Gpk1968]

9 hours ago, GarbagePatchKid said:

I think the results will show celina somewhere in the 5-7 score range, followed SS, NL, PT, and BC clustered in the mid-teens through 25 or so. I think there will be a gap between BC and Canton. I noticed a divide

🎯

Heck yeah. I was spot on

[Littlejoe]

Im my opinion Wills point had no business being in the finals. 

[Saxtastic45]

2 hours ago, GarbagePatchKid said:

IMO, Chuck has a reputation for some interesting scoring. 

I don’t know, I’ve had a few talks with friends about these new sheets. It’s supposed to eliminate preferences. What I am hearing is that some judges are ignoring the rubric and rewarding personal preferences. 
I wasn’t there and haven’t seen any runs. But I heard the following. 
what I see from the breakdown is this:

Celina is Celina. 
NL>SS in music? I thought this was going to be close but maybe the other way around. I thought SS power and production would win out with area level judges, especially outside. The visual scores between The’s 2 is what surprised me. I thought NL would beat them out with the demand. But I also heard it wasn’t that clean. 
PT was a pleasant surprise. Welcome back!

BC is not surprising. Great band. Enjoy State!

I’m pumped for Canton. Enjoy!

PG on a different run could have iced this. Well done. I bet they will be dangerous next year. 
 

WP is on its way. They will probably be my dark horse next year

VA is always solid. I just wish there was more to their production and cleanliness.

Mabank I heard played Rocky Point. I haven’t seen any vids. I also heard this was rough. 
 

Lumberton hasn’t changed its formula in a decade. I’ve never considered them clean. I’m honestly not surprised. Lots of notes not played at the same time. They have great players. They just need to work together better.

In conclusion: congrats on making finals. Lots of really good bands didn’t get to perform under the lights or move on at all.

[Gpk1968]

47 minutes ago, Littlejoe said:

Im my opinion Wills point had no business being in the finals. 

I thought they did great and I’m happy to see them return to area finals.

[sigmaboi]

dude these judges what were they on these scores are all over the place....

[Gpk1968]

1 minute ago, Saxtastic45 said:

I don’t know, I’ve had a few talks with friends about these new sheets. It’s supposed to eliminate preferences. What I am hearing is that some judges are ignoring the rubric and rewarding personal preferences. 
I wasn’t there and haven’t seen any runs. But I heard the following. 
what I see from the breakdown is this:

Celina is Celina. 
NL>SS in music? I thought this was going to be close but maybe the other way around. I thought SS power and production would win out with area level judges, especially outside. The visual scores between The’s 2 is what surprised me. I thought NL would beat them out with the demand. But I also heard it wasn’t that clean. 
PT was a pleasant surprise. Welcome back!

BC is not surprising. Great band. Enjoy State!

I’m pumped for Canton. Enjoy!

PG on a different run could have iced this. Well done. I bet they will be dangerous next year. 
 

WP is on its way. They will probably be my dark horse next year

VA is always solid. I just wish there was more to their production and cleanliness.

Mabank I heard played Rocky Point. I haven’t seen any vids. I also heard this was rough. 
 

Lumberton hasn’t changed its formula in a decade. I’ve never considered them clean. I’m honestly not surprised. Lots of notes not played at the same time. They have great players. They just need to work together better.

In conclusion: congrats on making finals. Lots of really good bands didn’t get to perform under the lights or move on at all.

Agree with your comments on Lumberton. Very fun show and a crowd pleaser but not on them same caliber as others, unfortunately. There were a lot of visual issues. A very talented group however, and I hope they can return to state next year. 
 

on the NL v. SS comments - The normal SS power just wasn’t there on Monday. I’ve complained about their volume in the past and maybe some judges did too because they seemed…..something. Timid? I’m struggling to find the adjective. Didn’t seem like the same band. Maybe it was nerves? I honestly thought they were going to tank in finals and was worried for them. 
 

NL plays with a lot of musicality and the visual package is 💯 

The complaint I’m hearing is that the judges didnt focus on their musical caption. One buddy said his brass tape included exactly two brass specific comments and they got a comparatively low score. They have no idea why, which is frustrating. Not saying who, or which judge 🤫 

[Saxtastic45]

4 minutes ago, GarbagePatchKid said:

Agree with your comments on Lumberton. Very fun show and a crowd pleaser but not on them same caliber as others, unfortunately. There were a lot of visual issues. A very talented group however, and I hope they can return to state next year. 
 

on the NL v. SS comments - The normal SS power just wasn’t there on Monday. I’ve complained about their volume in the past and maybe some judges did too because they seemed…..something. Timid? I’m struggling to find the adjective. Didn’t seem like the same band. Maybe it was nerves? I honestly thought they were going to tank in finals and was worried for them. 
 

NL plays with a lot of musicality and the visual package is 💯 

The complaint I’m hearing is that the judges didnt focus on their musical caption. One buddy said his brass tape included exactly two brass specific comments and they got a comparatively low score. They have no idea why, which is frustrating. Not saying who, or which judge 🤫 

I’ll bet NL not having their show complete till last week hurt them. I am pulling for them tbh. But is there enough time to get state clean? 

[Kmt1]

TVery surprised at some of the outcome.     I don't have anyone in particular....that I am associated with.    Which of these schools are positioned to move up/down in this nex cycle.  Would think Celina as they almost are at current 5A level?   How close is Pleasabt Grove?  For for they have mutiple schools on that area that can flex to what might make the more competitive.   Canto has come a long way.     So many championships.    Just remember when back in the day Argyle would win it all several years just to be on a trajectory upward as a larger school.    Some schools like Vandegrift never did that as they recognized the advantage.  

[Kmt1]

There was a rogue judge in this event.    No stakes in this, but it's clear.   Mr Bullock as chair of the region is responsible.    Anyone who has additional information should share with the UIL.     If they receive and dismiss the concern call your representative as they must answer to the state.   Schools spend thousands of dollars on this event.    No one seems to know of any sanctioning of judges who had pre-bias toward a school.   UIL knows and they will not admit it....because that would upset the stakeholders district.  There is a lack of transparency.   Sure , it's "just a silly marching band contest" but those young people deserve better than internal shenanigans by regional and state directors.  

[Bandnerd178]

3 hours ago, GarbagePatchKid said:

IMO, Chuck has a reputation for some interesting scoring. 

I’ve had him a couple competitions so far and every single one his scoring definitely makes you look twice.

[Gpk1968]

16 minutes ago, Kmt1 said:

There was a rogue judge in this event.    No stakes in this, but it's clear.   Mr Bullock as chair of the region is responsible.    Anyone who has additional information should share with the UIL.     If they receive and dismiss the concern call your representative as they must answer to the state.   Schools spend thousands of dollars on this event.    No one seems to know of any sanctioning of judges who had pre-bias toward a school.   UIL knows and they will not admit it....because that would upset the stakeholders district.  There is a lack of transparency.   Sure , it's "just a silly marching band contest" but those young people deserve better than internal shenanigans by regional and state directors.  

What in the world, my dude? Do you have actual proof of bias or are you just upset your band didn’t place where you believe they belonged? If it’s the later, move on please. Let’s celebrate one another and ALL strive to be better next year. 

[Dog885]

3 hours ago, GarbagePatchKid said:

IMO, Chuck has a reputation for some interesting scoring. 

 

ive heard him give some really good feedback but sometimes his rankings leave me scratching my head. 
 

that being said, i know im not an expert and I respect their experience and expertise. I’m sure there’s a rhyme to his reason. 

I mostly remember him for putting Cedar Ridge 9th in music at area finals in 2023. A real head scratcher, especially when it was straight 9th in every sub category including percussion

[Gpk1968]

1 minute ago, Dog885 said:

I mostly remember him for putting Cedar Ridge 9th in music at area finals in 2023. A real head scratcher, especially when it was straight 9th in every sub category including percussion

I remember that year. they basically got ranked close to first and close to last by judges. Bad year!

This is when judging seems extra hard to me. I know who is at the top. I know who is at the bottom. The middle? No clue. That’s where I see a lot of muddy scoring. 

that’s how I felt yesterday. I knew who likely wasn’t advancing and who definitely was. It was the “maybes” that had me stumped. 

[TexasStrangers]

I don't think there is a judge out there that is intentionally trying to sabotage anyone. I don't have a dog in the hunt either as I just like to watch high school marching bands. 

I do question at times how judges ended up scoring an event and why. 

Correct me if I am wrong but I heard that UIL monitors the judges at the State Meets and has a system in place to try and prevent someone from going Rogue. Kind of like a replay booth that gets flagged if they see some odd scoring taking place.

[Gpk1968]

Just now, TexasStrangers said:

I don't think there is a judge out there that is intentionally trying to sabotage anyone. I don't have a dog in the hunt either as I just like to watching high school marching bands. 

I do question at times how judges ended up scoring an event and why. 

Correct me if I am wrong but I heard that UIL monitors the judges at the State Meets and has a system in place to try and prevent someone from going Rogue. Kind of like a replay booth that gets flagged if they see some odd scoring taking place.

I believe this is correct  

I vaguely remember it being explained to me like this: if you have an outlying score you are given the chance to revisit your choice. No pressure to change. You can stick to your guns if you want. 

[J-Mike16]

I also agree with celebrating one another, even the bands that did not advance. Now I do have comments that I want to say out loud however, I have a lot of reputation within this community and do not wish to put that into jeopardy. I will just say, @Saxtastic45 I respect your comments and opinions; however, I feel like you have something against Lumberton because almost everything you say about them comes out to be in a negative way. I was a freshman 10 years ago in the Lumberton band program, and the formula then is WAY different than now. I do agree with you on cleanliness, I think they needed to clean more especially this year. I think it's because Lumberton is pushing for harder music and more complex-ish drill. Back when I was in the program, our drill was so easy, and music was not the most difficult. Don't get me started on choreography because that was nonexistent until my junior year (2017).  I just think that Lumberton tried a brand-new formula this year and unfortunately, it did not work out. Now next year, I think they will especially work harder to make a comeback. 

[Kmt1]

I stand by my statement.    The area secretary is compromised.   

[Saxtastic45]

23 minutes ago, J-Mike16 said:

I also agree with celebrating one another, even the bands that did not advance. Now I do have comments that I want to say out loud however, I have a lot of reputation within this community and do not wish to put that into jeopardy. I will just say, @Saxtastic45 I respect your comments and opinions; however, I feel like you have something against Lumberton because almost everything you say about them comes out to be in a negative way. I was a freshman 10 years ago in the Lumberton band program, and the formula then is WAY different than now. I do agree with you on cleanliness, I think they needed to clean more especially this year. I think it's because Lumberton is pushing for harder music and more complex-ish drill. Back when I was in the program, our drill was so easy, and music was not the most difficult. Don't get me started on choreography because that was nonexistent until my junior year (2017).  I just think that Lumberton tried a brand-new formula this year and unfortunately, it did not work out. Now next year, I think they will especially work harder to make a comeback. 

I am sorry you feel that way. I have nothing against any school or any band. 
I do have something against loud unfocused sounds not played together in time or in tune. I also have something against parking and barking. These are the issues I take with Lumberton’s “product”. Not with the students or the program in general. I love that you are Lumberton till you die. But being truthful is important. If the director and students listen to the feedback I’m sure they got without being offended they will get better. 
 

by the way. I know Chuck Moon and he is a heck of a director and musician. If he heard something a certain way, I’m sure he wasn’t far off. A lot of these bands are high quality. 

[Fanboy]

Are you saying that Lumberton is guilty of parking and barking? That’s funny because they literally do exactly what every other band did at area. 
And as far as Chuck’s accuracy I think it’s fair to say from his rankings that he was all over the place. Just look at pleasant groves prelims to finals. He single handedly cost them state. 

[Trumpeter75]

12 hours ago, GarbagePatchKid said:

I believe this is correct  

I vaguely remember it being explained to me like this: if you have an outlying score you are given the chance to revisit your choice. No pressure to change. You can stick to your guns if you want. 

I thought the rule I had read is that if one judge is really far away from the other judge then the head judge ask them to convene and discuss why the difference and come up with a moderation in the score be it an in between the two numbers. I think that is what I read in those UIL manuals. 

[Gpk1968]

11 minutes ago, Trumpeter75 said:

I thought the rule I had read is that if one judge is really far away from the other judge then the head judge ask them to convene and discuss why the difference and come up with a moderation in the score be it an in between the two numbers. I think that is what I read in those UIL manuals. 

Yeah. It’s something like that. I know they can revisit for sure.