1998-2018

That’s a bridge too far for me. Top programs are not propped up by the “scaffolding” of their prior achievements or reputation. This is an extremely complex activity and excellence and judging is not always clearly understood by the crowd in the stands. However, it is earned and then demonstrated repeatedly, or not. It’s definitely difficult to attain, but once achieved, excellence also typically has a momentum that is not easily lost. But it has nothing to do with reputation. For example, an excellent program must get their freshman up to the level the other students have already achieved. Additionally the program has already cracked the code and established the environment necessary to accomplish this year after year. In contrast, an up and coming program may need to increase the performance level of many more students across the classes and is also still working to establish an environment that consistently produces excellence. This is what makes it so difficult to break into the next level. Not reputation “scaffolding”. I will agree the Judges know these programs, but I can assure you they have no respect for reputation once the actual performance and judging begins. Examples abound in the relatively recent history of both Area B (including this year) and the SMBC. I’d like to be more specific but naming programs that may have come up short (past or present) can unpleasantly fire up forum participants so this is where I bow out and respectfully agree to disagree. In closing I will say I suspect many people will find the process less frustrating if they embrace this explanation and let go of the belief that “It’s always the same bands…” due to anything other than just that day’s performance. It can make the long journey to sustained excellence more understandable and satisfying.

I need some help with clarification, please. The intended meaning of your reply eludes me. 🤔 Edit: Wait…are you referring to the proverbial medal podium? Sure, that’s cool and it is Area B so it could help add to their reputation but are you forgetting they already have a BOA Regional win too? Don’t people already know who they are?

I have a long term affiliation with the KISD band programs and have enjoyed watching Timber Creek performances and growing maturity since the school opened. I think the underlying issue in this case may be the specificity of your observation. While it is true that “TC became an area medalist their second appearance in the state qualifiers” this is not particularly surprising in comparison to other things that happened at the competition . It’s also kind of like saying “X rarely happens on the third day of the seventh month of an odd numbered year.” The reality is Timber Creek has been the Area B runner up (6th place) five or six consecutive years before breaking through (5th place) and advancing to the SMBC last year. Timber Creek has already been a force within Area B for many years. They moved up one place last year. Two more places the next year is extremely satisfying for supporters of the program (like me) but not exactly unprecedented for an up and coming band in the activity. Especially when the band in question has been having such a strong year. Waxahachie’s recent trajectory has been similar. Consequently more attention has been paid to the judges sheets and how the preliminary and final rankings for all the bands were actually determined. Consensus, continuity, and consistency did not appear to rule the day. Having said that I don’t have a problem with who is advancing, even if my personal selections would have been slightly different. I really just wish there was room for a couple more.

Their recent history at this contest indicates they don’t need the break. I don’t understand all the early season doubt. The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior and Keller has been extremely consistent over the years. 😁 It’s clearly another year in Area B where someone very deserving will not be making the trip to the SMBC. May everyone have a great Finals run!

They’re up now…on Tuesday. It’s been awhile since they were uploaded the night of the contest, and initially waiting until Sunday morning seemed reasonable. Then that slipped to Monday. Now apparently we’re waiting until Tuesday?!? I know posting the recaps won’t change the outcome of the contest, but it does help explain the outcome and it’s taking longer and longer to get posted with each passing year.

Simply put, judges are paid to make a decision. The head judge would not allow a single judge to give two bands the same score. They would be instructed to choose one over the other. On the other hand two judges would be allowed to give the same score to two bands. That would mean the other judges scores would determine the bands ranking. There can initially be ties in ranking when scores are combined and converted to Ordinals. The 1999 UIL 4A SMBC had a three way tie in the middle of the pack after Finals. A detailed explanation for how an Ordinal tie is broken is available on the UIL website using that contest as an example. http://www.uiltexas.org/music/marching-band/marching-band-scoring-and-advancement-procedure And yes, Finals were dominated by Area B bands that night. Good times!

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain. Keller, undeniably being Keller. Thank you for recognizing them for staying true to who they are. Fearless!

Not only is that wrong, it's extremely disrespectful to Marcus and Flower Mound. Last year one of our Keller parents heard someone, from another program, say virtually the same thing about Flower Mound and immediately asked, "I don't think that's how it works, but if you know something I don't, can you tell me how much a string of State Marching Band Championships cost? Because I'm pretty sure we can get that funded." The same goes for a string of BOA San Antonio Super Regional wins. Trips to the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade or the Tournament of Roses Parade are a different situation, but competition wins are not for sale. Do you think Vista Ridge spent significantly more to win the 6A Texas SMBC last year compared to the budget two years ago when they were the first band out of San Antonio Super Regional Finals? I don't.

There have been questions about the unusually high number of falls. We noticed the turf was brighter, cleaner, maybe even greener. Then someone else pointed out the center field and end zone logos are all gone. New turf?

Hmm, maybe...but that could be a bit of an overstatement and I doubt they would struggle for long.

Really?!? What's gotten into the group tonight? It seems like you could have followed your own advice and stopped typing one sentence sooner. Just a thought...a very ironic thought...

That's an interesting point and it's supported by the fact that BOA San Antonio and 6A SMBC both include the usual suspects in Finals. The placements may vary a bit but the players are practically identical.

Responding only because questions were asked: Absolutely not, bands do it all the time. But that's not pacing. It doesn't. Pacing does, i.e., not to slow, but also not to fast, so you peak/finish at the right time. Okay, having a daughter who has moved on to DCI, that made me laugh. The comment is articulate, respectful, on point, and well meaning, even though it's clearly not a compliment. Trust me, I was bored with this tedium long ago. ja2austintx is right, can we stop beating this poor dead horse?

It's a unique and worthwhile experience and it's getting even better. This year I really noticed how they are changing their drill to capitalize on their size. The way they are moving blocks of the band has definitely changed and I'm glad to hear it's intentionally purposeful. At multiple points throughout the show I was thinking, "Hey, that's cool, when did they start doing that?" It won't happen overnight but when they get to the point where they add movement within those large blocks, like the Keller closer or what the Madison Scouts did this summer, we can all be very afraid. Awesome potential.

Scores have been posted on the Duncanville ISD website.

And now we've seen the transition to overt aggression and insults. That clearly doesn't encourage civil conversation or productive debate of ideas.

I understand this is likely the intended meaning. It's also exactly what I objected too. In my experience, this is not how elite programs of any kind, marching or otherwise, think or operate. What has been implied by extension is that Marcus doesn't really care that their show was virtually flawlessly clean yesterday because their season doesn't end until San Antonio. Restated in those terms, I would think the inherent flaw in logic would be easy to identify. The Marcus show is clean at this point because it is more within, for lack of a better term, the comfort zone of their ability. And they want it that way because they feel it gives them the best chance for success. (Please don't go running for the pitchforks and torches. The Marcus show has a very high degree of difficulty.) What I'm saying is that it is erroneous to think that Hebron is actively managing a "slower growth rate" or "timing their peak" for a few weeks from now. Edit: By holding back now, i.e., pacing. If the show could be perfect now, it would. Timing and pacing be damned. They would them work on maintaining that level of focus and performance for the next few weeks. Like Marcus being Marcus. Relentlessly. I'm sure Hebron's, and Keller's, leadership is not concerned about yesterday. They are knowingly pushing the limits of the program's comfort zone of ability, with more time available for the necessary work. But I maintain, they're not pacing themselves. Edit: Holding back to maintain a scheduled timeline.

Wonderful. More sarcastic, passive aggression. Like there isn't already far too much of it on display in this community. Since you seem to be missing my main point I will try to clarify. Please notice I selected a very specific line from your original comment and deleted/ignored the rest. It was intended to show my comment is focused on that one area of what you said. I did not voice objection to anything else in your comment. Why? Because most of what you said is relevant and reasonably accurate. But, in my view, blending the concept of pacing unnecessarily reduced the accuracy and convoluted what you said. Pace is a word with multiple definitions and in this context your usage seems to imply that Hebron is somehow managing this season differently because it is two weeks longer. Like how an athlete uses a different strategy for expenditure of energy in 100, 200, and 400 meter races. I simply disagree. You did say they may have made more difficult design choices knowing they would have an additional two weeks to clean the show. Perhaps. I clearly didn't choose to debate that point. I also don't think Hebron's design this year is uncharacteristically difficult for them. As I said previously, it's Hebron being Hebron. And at this level everyone's performance gets better with two more weeks of work, regardless of design difficulty. That had nothing to do with pacing. It's because of the work. If, in the end, you think we are just debating semantics, I will stand by what I said while agreeing to disagree without further debate. If you think I have misunderstood your original comment and would like to restate/clarify it, I'd love to hear what you have to say. Without the sarcasm.

Pace, or pacing, is still the wrong word (and concept) for what you are describing. Just because it is a common misuse (or misunderstanding) in the marching community does not make it any less wrong.

Yes, they will be posted on the Duncanville ISD DMI website.

Hebron's Preliminary run had some dirt in the more difficult sections of the drill and this is nothing new for them. The music performance was clean, not flawless, but difficult and clean. In other words, Hebron doing what Hebron does. In Finals, Hebron had the same issues with the more difficult sections of their drill but they also had several sections of their music performance that were a bit less clean, less clear, less crisp than the Preliminary run. The second run just wasn't as strong and at this level of competition it left them vulnerable. I do not believe for a second that what happened tonight had anything to do with Hebron pacing for a longer season. That's not how it works. Especially at an elite program. Meanwhile, Marcus did what Marcus does. Relentlessly. There's no big mystery here. Tonight was actually remarkably similar to what happened last week in Waco. Clean is King...and it's good to be the King.

True. And we know Keller will be cleaning like mad during the two weeks between Waco and San Antonio. James Bowie's show and storytelling at Waco seemed complete. So other than minor cleaning and addressing some bugs in the mics/sound mix, have they peaked? Or do more surprises await?

And together they give an interesting perspective on different show design philosophies.

Wait...I didn't say that... Oh, yep... Ha! Been there... No!!! Not that! Try scrolling down to the bottom of the page and hit the "Full Version" button. Then rotate your phone to landscape, drag the display to a readable size when you comment, quote, or edit, and everything should look pretty much like it does on a PC or tablet.

Scoring system differences aside, it should still be a good "eyeball" comparison.