WC show offensive??

[melody]

I saw the WC show at least three times this season (I'm a band parent at another school.) The first time I saw it, yes, I was offended... when I saw the words. It's a very striking visual effect, and seeing 'rage' and 'hate' and 'fear' spelled out by a marching band is jarring.

 

Art? Yes, it was a very artistic production, and true art, like music, should stir you. Art evokes strong emotional reactions... and not necessarily positive reactions. I can appreciate the show for its art. And more importantly, I can appreciate the show for the musical excellence, creativity, and marching skill. The kids worked hard and performed well, and I respect that.

 

Enjoyable? Not to me. I wrote in my competition notes only one word: "hate". I hated this show. Other reactions from people in the stands around me were interesting - some did not understand the show, and surprisingly, some could not pick out the words! Still others were as disturbed by it as I was.

 

Because I had such a negative reaction, emotionally, to this show, it did make me wonder about the risk in performing a show like this. Judges seem to love groups that take risks with their show and do something new, edgy, or artsy. If I been the director, though, I would have not been willing to risk the subliminal insertion of "hate" into a judges mind. And if I had been a judge, it would have been difficult to want to put this show through to finals/state. Obviously WC did just fine with the judges, but would they have done better without spelling out those words? Would they have placed better with another show? Who knows.

 

As I read through this thread, I still have mixed feelings about it. My personal conclusion (my own little humble opinion) I think it was inappropriate content for a high school marching band show. My elementary school aged daughter saw this performance, and the content was too mature for her. I know she wasn't the only young child exposed to this "art". And while the content matter may be appropriate for a high school academic discussion or study, band season is a long time for a teenage mind to be immersed in strait jackets and 'hate'.

 

The students did a great job with the show they were given, but I do hope that the adults involved with the WC program will choose to go with more positive shows in the future.

[kdnblue142]

Interesting,

It seems that the adults are reading way too much in this program while the kids seem to understand that it's "all about the music". I am not aware at this time of any of the band parents at WC being bothered by this program. If there was/is, I am sure I will hear about it at tomorrow's monthly band parent meeting.

All of the parents I spoke with through out the season were genuinely surprised, my self included, at why anyone would object to the one word "hate". We certainly did not see a problem. It's a genuine word and a real emotion. Are we supposed to hide all negatives from our kids and raise them in a bubble?

 

I worked five years in a lock-down county mental health facility (ER-graveyard shift) in another state,I know what schizophrenia and all the other mental illnesses are. The whole system in this county is very sad and frustrating. But this is not the forum for this subject.

 

But I also would not deny anyone their own opinion as I would not have my own be denied. You either like something or you don't. The judging in all these contests reflect this all the time. But my whole problem to this whole situation is that it feels as if the band is being blind-sided 'after the fact'. To come along a few weeks later after is all over and done, go on a public news outlet, and call a whole band ignorant and insensitive. And what really bothers be is that the band was not given a chance to speak out on it's own behalf. The whole article was very one-sided. What ever happened to fair and balanced and researched reporting? Apparently it's been dead and gone for the sake of ratings. How easy it is to 'attack' a high school marching band. That's insensitive and ignorant. The reporter did not even try to find out what the music and theme were all about. Does anyone know what a "metaphor" is? And duh, of course the show will not be performed again, marching season is DONE.

 

I guess we're supposed to make it a sweet and light program so we're careful not to offend anyone? Give me a break. How boring and unchallenging. These kids don't want it all sweetness and light. I don't speak for all of these kids, but they seem to want challenges and complexities in their programs. Go read some of the other postings. I really get tired of hearing adults continually underestimate the intelligence of teenagers.

 

I hope our kids take this as a learning experience and not be bitter about it.

[Euphftw]

Me as a band student really don't see the problem with the words hate and manic. And neither did my parent i guess sience they seen WC's show twice in my marching season and loved the creativeness of it. And i must say the colorguard is amazing as always straitjakets and all lmao. And i found the news report hilarious i LOLED when the reported said "This show will never be performed again" in a dramatic voice, well duh you idiot their season is over xD.

[actualgirltrombone]

I really can't understand how spelling out the word hate is "too mature" for a high school marching band. For petes sake, even Finding Nemo uses the word hate. Medea is not meant to portray niceness or sweetness, but its still a perfectly legitimate expression of emotion. I guess I'm speaking from the perspective of a high school student, but I don't get what the problem is with wanting to express something different on the field.

[lhstrumpet]

I'm surprised that this news article doesn't mention the story behind the piece Medea. That seems to play a critical role in the marching design.

 

If people read the play / watched / read a synopsis of Medea, the show would make a lot more sense.

 

Then again you can't expect that everybody has done so, kind of like LD Bell 2007.

 

Program notes for all bands would help this situation. :DD

[Danpod]

We all realize that it's just a marching band show, right? Do you really think the designers of the show set out to piss off the Mental Health Community? This isn't like the Mortal Kombat Era when there was a huge public outcry against kids playing video games that were too violent. It's a marching show.

 

There have been far more offensive things to have gone down on the field:

 

Tarpon Springs 2001 - During the ballad, pictures of the 9/11 Attacks were held up for the whole audience to see. The band also brought out the Memorial Chairs from the Oklahoma City Bombings, sat down on them, and played.

 

Paris H.S., TX 2003 - They performed a show titled Visions of World War II. As part of the show, one student ran across the field with a huge Nazi flag. If that wasn't bad enough, they performed this show at a football game one Friday, which just so happened to land on Rosh Hashanah (The Jewish New Year).

 

Ironically, in the Modern Day of Marching Arts, spelling words out on the field can be considered a little on the immature side. I think that this situation is completely overblown and this kind of negative attention that is put on any program is really lame. The intent of the message seems to get lost in all of this. The show is titled Symphonic Schizophrenia. Each movement in the show has an entirely different feel. The intent of the show was not to say that all mental health patients should be locked up. The intent of the show was to showcase a variety of musical and visual ideas. But hey, I guess that all goes out the window when someone cries "Wolf!"

 

Like the late George Carlin said:

It's bull****. And it's bad for ya.

[pokerface]

Any time an event like this occurs, it reminds me of the man that once had his own talk radio show on television.

His name? Don Imus.

Edited November 16, 2008 by pokerface

[Danpod]

Any time an event like this occurs, it reminds me of the man that once had his own talk radio show on television.

His name? Don Imus.

 

I can see where you're going with that but the key here is intent. He intended to say what he said. There wasn't much gray area with that incident.

[urkadrums]

I can see where people could be offended.

I think that some slack need to be given to these people though. Not every audience member is commenting on the musical selection, or watching if feet are in time, or commenting on double tonguing or whatever. Many are watching visuals and the overall show, aka parents, many band kids.

 

When I saw the show at BOA SA, I was surprised at the visual content matter. I didn't particularly like it, and I thought that many WOULD feel uncomfortable, especially if they knew someone with a mental illness (for instance, I have a teacher who has a brother who is schizophrenic, and it hurts her feelings when people stereotype it as the whole padded wall business).

 

I know it is art, but I think that it has to be realized that the show is being performed not only for judges and for people who look at the technical part of things, but for people that just watch it as a whole, people who aren't focus on marching band fundamentals.

I understand the offense.

[kdnblue142]

If people read the play / watched / read a synopsis of Medea, the show would make a lot more sense.

 

Then again you can't expect that everybody has done so, kind of like LD Bell 2007.

 

Program notes for all bands would help this situation. :DD

Ha, you're right about LD Bell 07. First time I saw this program was BOA San Antonio, at the finals. Myself and other parents were like "what????". We thought it was creepy, did not understand it. Well, when I did find out and watched again several times on youtube, I GOT IT!!!! Duh on me.

Yeah, program notes would probably be an excellent idea for us "ignorant" adults.

[kdnblue142]

Oh ****

I finally sat down to read the sunday paper. Well, there's a story on the front page of the metro section. It gives more detail (if you're not in town, you can go online to mysa.com)

It states that NAMI did not receive any complaints until after state finals and that Dickey got a complaint from a parent whose daughter is in the band who was upset as well as the family.

Really,

I am trying to restrain myself....I go to all the band parent meetings. We always have an opportunity to stand up and make any statement or to address any concern that anyone may have. I guess you have to attend a meeting and be involved. I have been to the region, area, and finals for state. I was also at BOA SA both as a volunteer and as a spectator. I have never heard one parent complain about what was being portrayed. There are many involved parents and family members and you see these same people at the meetings, rehearsals, performances. Part of a band's success is the parents behind the scenes, at least that is my opinion.

 

There is a very ugly comment about today's Texas marching bands at the end of the website article. You have to read it to believe it. It's from a football parent who obviously went to Texas A & M since they are the only good marching band in the state. Not my words, his words. What is being said it the most ignorant, expletive, expletive piece of expletive I have ever read. That person is a "d**k".

 

I can't wait to go to tomorrow's band parent meeting. It promises to be very, very interesting. Probably be one of longest one ever.

[pokerface]

I can see where you're going with that but the key here is intent. He intended to say what he said. There wasn't much gray area with that incident.

 

I totally agree. It's just a reminder that you have to walk on eggshells in the public spotlight. Political correctness has obviously never been something I cared much for, but i'm very aware of it. It's very disheartening to see (of all things!!) a highschool marching band come under fire for something so insignificant. If there's one thing I hate it's one sided stories- everyone deserves a rebuttle or explanation.

 

I don't think WC got a fair shake on this, and the kids learn nothing valuable other than you have to limit yourself when being artistic...otherwise you might offend someone or hurt their feelings. Ignorance isn't always bliss.

Edited November 17, 2008 by pokerface

[TXBandNerd07]

Oh ****

I finally sat down to read the sunday paper. Well, there's a story on the front page of the metro section. It gives more detail (if you're not in town, you can go online to mysa.com)

It states that NAMI did not receive any complaints until after state finals and that Dickey got a complaint from a parent whose daughter is in the band who was upset as well as the family.

Really,

I am trying to restrain myself....I go to all the band parent meetings. We always have an opportunity to stand up and make any statement or to address any concern that anyone may have. I guess you have to attend a meeting and be involved. I have been to the region, area, and finals for state. I was also at BOA SA both as a volunteer and as a spectator. I have never heard one parent complain about what was being portrayed. There are many involved parents and family members and you see these same people at the meetings, rehearsals, performances. Part of a band's success is the parents behind the scenes, at least that is my opinion.

 

There is a very ugly comment about today's Texas marching bands at the end of the website article. You have to read it to believe it. It's from a football parent who obviously went to Texas A & M since they are the only good marching band in the state. Not my words, his words. What is being said it the most ignorant, expletive, expletive piece of expletive I have ever read. That person is a "d**k".

 

I can't wait to go to tomorrow's band parent meeting. It promises to be very, very interesting. Probably be one of longest one ever.

 

so. you're saying that someone waited pretty much the WHOLE ENTIRE season to complain about the show??? all the opportunities and they wait until the season's over to say something?? is that what you're saying?

[wctuba2010]

the article in the newspaper also says that the school district did tell us there was offensive material and we did change what they wanted us to change and they saw the show multiple times and never told us that it was inappropriate so the directors and visual coordinator can not be blamed for this

[TXBandNerd07]

the article in the newspaper also says that the school district did tell us there was offensive material and we did change what they wanted us to change and they saw the show multiple times and never told us that it was inappropriate so the directors and visual coordinator can not be blamed for this

 

 

and see the thing is, you KNOW the district or the school admin would be the first people to be like "hey, this could be offensive" because they try to avoid situations like this... ugh.. this is dumb.

[wctuba2010]

if you find this show offensive just don't watch it go watch a nice fun motivational show like the Cadets 2008

[kdnblue142]

Just a thought...

If this so-called student was disturbed by the show, why did she continue to perform it? And what parent allow their child to perform in something they felt was disturbing, controversial? And then complain about it later? Wouldn't most people request to be dropped out or something similar? Is this not possible? Wouldn't this person be a detriment to the program and not commit to doing their best?

[TXBandNerd07]

Just a thought...

If this so-called student was disturbed by the show, why did she continue to perform it? And what parent allow their child to perform in something they felt was disturbing, controversial? And then complain about it later? Wouldn't most people request to be dropped out or something similar? Is this not possible? Wouldn't this person be a detriment to the program and not commit to doing their best?

 

 

yea seriously. if they were so "offended" then why the heck to continue to be apart of it. and like you said, what parent allows their kid to be a part of something they're not comfortable.

 

this just doesnt add up. again. why wait until after the seasons over to complain. they're not going to march again so why bring it up at that point?

[majortuba]

if you find this show offensive just don't watch it go watch a nice fun motivational show like the Cadets 2008

 

 

agreed.

 

the show is based primarily off the story of the schizophrenic, mythological character of Medea.

heck, our homework during band camp was to look up the story of the woman who killed her babies.

 

the words, the walls, the straight jackets..it's all art.

just accept it. it's been performed many times now. it's there in the history books. there's nothing you or ed dickey can do about it. if you don't like it, don't watch. stop complaining.

[CPFrntEns]

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_new...ds_routine.html

 

Here's another story on this with the comments kdnblue142 was talking about. The comment in question (I'm assuming) is amc11811's comment. I agree with you, kdnblue142, that comment is so ignorant, it makes me want to hunt down that guy and force him to watch real Texas marching band, not whatever he saw.

 

Anyway, I'm on chuchill's side here. It's art, they can do whatever they want with it. Plus, as they've said, schizophrenia refers to the mythological character Medea, not the mentally ill. But I'm just repeating what others have said. Keep it up WC.

Edited November 17, 2008 by CPFrntEns

[Fata1]

That one comment that kdnblue142 pointed out pisses me off. There's so much bull in that one comment that I can't even pick it apart. To say that the band only marches between the two forty yard lines is one of the biggest lies I've ever heard. It's bad enough that people are criticizing one of the finest marching programs in the state for performing a piece of art but to then go and make up lies to try and bring them down further is ridiculous. The sad fact is that there are people that will believe them simply because they don't know enough about the marching arts to know better.

 

Honestly, though, did "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest" get this much crap. It's one of the finest books ever written and the movie is almost equally as good. It portrays mental patients and their doctors in demeaning ways and yet it's widely revered as one of the finest pieces of American literature. This is all so wrong.

[majortuba]

it amazes me how many people are putting so much work into bringing the churchill band down.

why doesnt ed dickey use his time WISELY and actually HELP THE MENTALL ILL instead of dissing us?

[kdnblue142]

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_new...ds_routine.html

 

Here's another story on this with the comments kdnblue142 was talking about. The comment in question (I'm assuming) is amc11811's comment. I agree with you, kdnblue142, that comment is so ignorant, it makes me want to hunt down that guy and force him to watch real Texas marching band, not whatever he saw.

 

Anyway, I'm on chuchill's side here. It's art, they can do whatever they want with it. Plus, as they've said, schizophrenia refers to the mythological character Medea, not the mentally ill. But I'm just repeating what others have said. Keep it up WC.

Yes, that is the one I was talking about. It's really heating up on that message board right now. Big time. Parents who wouldn't ordinarily post on this site or even know about it are certainly speaking out on that one. Especially since there are some really ugly comments about Mike Sloane and Albert Lo. And to some of the people who post on this site also.

[SeaMoosi]

i just sent an email to the NAMI san antonio expressing how i felt.

 

basically, to make yall apologize is to make yall throw away all you did this season. despite what the show said or if it offended someone, yall worked your butts off to make the show as perfect and amazing as possible. if you have to apologize that, then there's more wrong with society than i ever thought before.

 

i hope that these guys will realize theyre starting something big over nothing.

[TXBandNerd07]

ok.. the main point of this NOW shouldnt be if it's offensive but the fact that WHY would you continue to let your child march the rest of the season when you and your kid are disturbed by it AND THEN say something AFTER state. i mean how stupid is that? who in their right mind does that?? if you found it offensive then you should've done something.. oh i dunno, AT THE BEGINNING of the season? god.. and yea, to apologize is basically like saying "sorry we were participating in something we enjoy doing and are good at." i still dont get why a PARENT would wait until after the season's over. do they realize that, ok so you might have the mental institutions on your side but YOU look like the mental one since no one can figure out why a parent would let their child participate in something that the child nor the parents were comfortable with and then complain when they arent marching the show anymore...

 

they are making a big deal over nothing.