takigan

I think you can as long as the dates all line up, but even if it's legal in both TMEA and ATSSB you can't do it if your school doesn't let you (they'd have to pay the fees for both competitions as well as be a member of both ATSSB and TMEA which entails dues of their own). I'd ask your director.

Sure.....your mind performs better when it's already warmed up and in gear. Why does UIL not allow Contrabassoon to perform solos for Solo and Ensemble? (I don't think I've ever heard a Contrabassoon solo, ever).

Heh.....sorry. My first exposure to Drum Corps was through the tutelage of a Bluecoats purist....I was taught the ways of the Bluecoats and was thus taught to abhor the Glassmen for no other reason than who they are. I've dislodged myself from the ground and blossomed into my own identity now (Bluecoats aren't really my favorite by a long shot; I prefer BD and Phantom, with my underdog corps being Madison, Crossmen and Blue Stars), but some of my old roots still remain.

Well the Crown typo might have been a bit hard to catch, but where the heck is Phantom?!! Beneath Assmen? As if

You know, I love it when we get to see multiple bands from other states attend our Regionals. I'm particularly fond of the ones that come from states other than the immediate neighboring ones (Oklahoma, Louisiana, Arkansas, New Mexico) because you know exactly why they're taking the time to come down here (to show their school how good Texas bands are and to see how they compare). It's typical to see multiple states represented at other regionals in the midwest since the states are so close together in those areas while Texas competitions are primarily homogenous since the state is so ridiculously huge! I wish I was as into marching arts in 2002 as I am now so I could have been a part of the hype when Carmel HS from Indiana showed up at the front gate of the Texas BOA stronghold in San Antonio and proceeded to slaughter all of the Texas bands, capturing the Gold medal......well, maybe not 'slaughtered'...it was actually pretty close as .25 was all that separated Carmel and L.D. Bell;--which, based on the scores, was obviously the only Texas band at the competition that could match Carmel man for man since a 3-5 point spread separated those 2 the whole time from the rest of the sea of bands that were there competing). It's concepts like this that make me wish Broken Arrow HS would regularly attend Arlington and San Antonio. But there's no obvious reason as to why this is and it's not like you can e-mail the band director to ask why this is as I think that would be kind of rude, lol ^^; .

Arlington for sures: Berkner Cedar Park Colleyville Heritage Coppell Hebron Marcus The Woodlands Lafayette "Heel biters": Conally Newman Smith Martin Georgetown Fossil Ridge Lewisville Houston for sures: Churchill The Woodlands Stephen F. Austin Reagan Langham Creek LD Bell Westfield "Heel-biters" The Woodlands CP Spring Clear Brook Cy-Falls Pearland Klein Hendrickson Clements Houston is definitely the "stacked" Regional this time around and it's hard to place sure bets for this reason, plus some shaky programs in recent years (I've always been under the impression that Spring is an incredible program on par with Westfield, Cedar Park, Churchill etc.....but I'm no longer sure where to place them after their uncharacteristically low placements last year, same goes for Cy-Falls which is a recovering program) make it hard to tell how it'll all play out.

Only 3 Texas bands at nationals? any explanation on the small number? And 52 bands at San Antonio on a state year, man!......One of these years SA's going to max out 60 bands every year whether it's a state year or not.

In my opinion, the GE caption isn't really fair because it really has very little to do with the kids themselves and their hard work. I mean if you have a crappy, CRAPPY show but the kids still perform it well, they'll still lose to schools with awesome show concepts, even if they don't perform as welll. Perfect example is Duncanville at the Sam Houston festival this year. The band just looks amazing they way they march and they have an awesome sound, but their show was boring as crap. Musicality itself is of course part of GE, but not enough to offset the edge given by a killer concept delivered through the use of expensive props and equipment and paying top dollar for the best visionary artists that not everybody can afford. But, GE is a very good caption to have. It is the reason why such great shows exist, and without it there's little incentive for the staff to give their students a powerful work of art for them to harness and make their own. I would kill to be able to perform shows as jawdropping as Bell's trilogy, or Marcus's innovative concepts. Their shows have electronics and props out the @$$ and give them an unfair advantage (easily surmountable through superb playing, but it's still an advantage), but without the promise of higher placement due to GE, these incredible shows would not exist and the students would be denied the chance to experience spectacular, grandiose works of art. Alot of schools hold back on alot of their show elements for UIL contest because they feel they'd be too liberal for the competition. I wonder how many times a school has refrained from using a cool visual or an elaborate, complex yet surreal electronic sound texture because they were afraid of losing points in UIL competition. It's not about promoting or stifling art, that's not the issue. It's about giving kids the best possible experience they can have within the limits of their district's budget. Keeping band fun and constantly making them say "OMG, I LOVE this part!!!" everytime they play music, on or off the field.

I competed 5A in HS 4 years and never competed in an ATSSB region but I have judged one. I have also judged a 4A TMEA region as well and have known in college many people with track records in all the bands and have equated this with their respective abilities..... Think of it this way (and this isn't the case with all regions/areas, but is the prevalent trend): 5A All-State Symphonic Band > 5A All-State Concert Band > 5A All-Area > 5A All-Region top half = ATSSB Symphonic Band = 4A All-State Band (there's only one) > 4A All-Area > ATSSB Concert Band = 5A All-Region bottom half > ATSSB All-Area > 4A All-Region = ATSSB All-Region

Wow....The Mansfield district sure does some great shows. This is awesome.....I accidently watched their 2006 show first and that one was even better (who's the drill writer for this band btw?). First time I've ever seen "The Walk" on the field. That song was #1 on my iTunes for a good while back in the day. I love Imogen Heap!

lol, close enough on the spelling . That's a fun one. I played that for a church gig once; played the Trombone part. Most Bach (...I think it's Bach) brass quintets sound better with a Euphonium instead of a Trombone imo, it gives the ensemble a more somber, softer edge. There's one part where the Trombone gets to rock out with the French Horn that I could just play over and over again, especially when the Horn player you're playing with is a bad@ss, hehe (she's currently Assistant Principal Horn in the Texas State Wind Ensemble).

SHSU Wind Ensemble concert at Woodlands: College Park HS last Thursday: Fandangos - Sierra Postcards - Ticheli Were You There? - Lynch La Fiesta Mexicana - Reed March of the Belgian Parachuters - Leeman 3 'Grade 5' pieces, 60 minute program and we got all the music in mid-January so we only had 4 1/2 weeks to learn it (basically 11 2-hour rehearsals...we rehearse about half to 2/3s as often as a typical 5A band). When the band walked in to the dress rehearsal before the concert we had only ran through the 3rd movement of La Fiesta (which is a 20 minute long suite) 3 times. The ensemble had a good sound and held together, but there were an uncountable number of fracked notes and missed entrances....we had the ability to bring it together but our heads just weren't in the game for those 4 weeks. We're getting a new program on Monday and the next concert isn't until April so hopefully it'll be better then :/.

lol, sorry guys ....Ok, take step back *breaths*, ok.... So yeah, how about those DCI Rule Proposals; we'll start things off with a big round of applause for George Hopkins who finally succeeded in sucking all the talent out of Drum Corps and replacing us with machines.

Ok let me rephrase that (since I am aware of this fact as well): HIGH SCHOOL Marching Bands were created for the purposes of entertaining halftime crowds. The football thing is a new, an very interesting, fact I've just learned. That's pretty cool...thanks for sharing, I should remember that next time I argue against someone who believes that having a marching band at football games is pointless. But it doesn't really prove anything here for the sake of argument. I'm aware of this drill maneuver's existence before the Cavaliers 95 show in Spring HS's 93 show....and your argument holds true in this regard (basically for the last 15 years or so of Drill Writing), but this doesn't show that it's always been this way. Again, I'm not saying you're wrong...but I've been under the impression that corps and marching band drill was constructed very differently until marching bands began to adopt the Drum Corps style by hiring their affiliated Drill Writers. Increased involvement in the industry could have spurred some of the Drill Writers to introduce their ideas to Marching Bands before Drum Corps due to various circumstances (maybe getting dropped by a corps and having to make a little money on the side in-between major corps jobs or maybe just a personal preference for one medium over the other). I don't see it this way. A good number of people agree (maybe not most, but I'd say a good chunk) with *most* of statements. I'm just really vocal and intense about it which makes me seem a little mean. I like arguing about these kinds of things, and I try to be intense, yet civil about it. Only thing I don't like are people who look at my argument and in their reply post this utterly blindsighted reply about how could I possibly think the way I do and I'm obviously wrong and present this weak hearted argument to respond to it--which I proceed to rip apart and silence them in my following post. Not saying that's happened here yet, but yeah....I like debating, I'm quite controversial .

You see the competitions as being the most important thing. But keep in mind your program would not exist without the support of your district, and if ya'll didn't perform at football games the district wouldn't support it, only in special cases is this not true (UT Arlington for example). But even so, Marching Programs tell the communities that support them to shove it and perform music that only the art community (Band Directors, judges, musicians, marching arts advocates etc.) can appreciate and they do it entirely for themselves. It means something to you as a performer so you don't care that no one wants to listen to it and so you push on. The kinds of shows Marching Bands these days do is mainly due to a concession made by the public. It's still music, and they know you're learning complicated stuff in the process that will serve you better later on in life, so they're willing to be bored by it for the sake of that. This is just the community as a whole though....I'd be lying if I said that no one likes it.....just that most of the mainstream public doesn't. Spare me the bluntness and provide me an argument with substance other than "mmm, well I disagree". Marching Band was created for the single purpose of halftime entertainment. It means different things to people under different contexts nowadays, mostly due to more theatric spinoffs of the art including DCI and Blast! ....and that's a great thing. I'm really not sure how else to respond to this ?_? Explain.....I'm not saying I disagree with you, I just can't think of anything other than microphones and amps. In Marching Bands being inspired by Corps, I was referring to the composition of the drill, the marching style, small aesthetic elements like cymbal carriage, visuals, the structure of the musical passages among many other things. Mic'd solos are a no no IMO, regardless of what it is that's mic'd. I'm not really sure about singular woodwind instruments being used for solos in the Front Ensemble. Even a slide whistle can be considered a Woodwind instrument in some regards, though it's actually a percussion instrument. I'd stay away from that one simply because it creates excuses for further legislation. True. But what you're looking for is an artistic, interesting sound. You'd lose the element of genuine woodwind sound, that's true. But in my view it's a small price to pay for my greater vision (even though, again it is quite radical and would never be realized). One more thing, you can combine quotes from different people into a single post. No need to clutter the board with multiple posts in a row that address different things from different people.

You merely asked me to try and understand what it must feel like to be a Woodwind player who can't play in a Brass Ensemble from an individual's perspective. The fact that the Euphonium is a single instrument versus an entire instrument family that's being excluded from an ensemble bears no relevance to what you've asked me to do. I was asked to relate as an individual so that I could better understand with an open mind the position a Woodwind player is in, being who they are before I made up said mind that woodwinds shouldn't be included in the activity. I think that they should understand that you shouldn't compromise the integrity of a special banquet of sound just so that they can get fair treatment as an instrumental group. The only reason such a sentiment exists is due to the fact that woodwinds are used in High School Marching Bands, which are nothing more than a group of instrumentalists that provide halftime entertainment at football games. Drum Corps is an entirely different activity, an entirely different subject. And since High School Marching Bands are more greatly influenced by Drum Corps than Drum Corps are by Marching Bands, and since Drum Corps is also the model they strive to be, I think it would make more sense to remove Woodwinds from the High School Marching Band rather than include them in DCI. That way a cleaner, more fluid sound can be obtained with minimal loss in volume due to having all the deadweight instruments--that aren't adding enough volume to the soundwall to justify the loss in tonality their presence creates--removed completely from the ensemble (with the exception of featured solos). The loss of color the woodwinds create can be made up for with an increase in synth textures.....since electronics can be turned up to match the intensity of-- and even overpower-- the brass, if that's what the director wants to do. But I'm being a little radical here, I know, lol......This would never happen and I'm not saying it should. I like listening to marching band, and I appreciate each section in its own way (except bass clarinets--the one instrument you can't hear unless everybody else shuts up, lol), and I'm not trying to be racist or anything but woodwinds need to understand they're not equal to the brass on that field.....the activity was made for brass....the 'woods are expendable. The woodwinds are just posers that vyed for equal rights and got them, but they should know their place.

I play Euphonium. I love the sound of the Symphony Orchestra, strings are really cool, and in the professional world the Symphony garners more respect than the Wind Band. I'm also "unofficially" a Euphonium Performance major in college and the chance to play in a Symphony would be really cool. But the Symphony doesn't allow Euphonium players in it....should I complain and demand that the members of the Symphony think about what it's like to be a Euphonium player and let us have a place in it because we would add a new color of sound to the ensemble? No....A Symphony is a Symphony and a Wind Ensemble is a Wind Ensemble, a Euphonium is made for Wind Ensemble and Violins are made for Symphonies (most of them wouldn't care to play with a Wind Ensemble anyways). The majority of the members would rather not have us in there anyway and the ones that aren't against it are simply indifferent (they don't care either way).

Brass and Percussion make up a Drum and Bugle Corps. If you add woodwinds, what would you call it? Drum, Bugle and Woodwind Corps? Or instead of Drum Corps International, why not call it Marching Band International Electrophones (instruments that produce sound through electricity) are typically regarded as percussion instruments.....this is how they've been found acceptable and how they were admitted before woodwinds. I honestly don't think they'll ever allow woodwinds....well, maybe as soloist instruments or used to produce sound effects, but I don't see them entering the field, and even if they enter the field I don't see them ever leaving the front of it. I can't believe there are people out there who view Drum Corps as just "A marching band without woodwinds". There are people out there who actually think this.....it creates the open-ended idea that woodwinds can be added to it at a later time. It's not like that.....it was a unique kind of ensemble created for a unique kind of purpose and a unique kind of sound. Drum Corps were modeled after the British Brass bands. It is a fact some of these brass bands later added woodwinds, which eventually evolved them into wind bands, but brass bands still coexist alongside them. I wouldn't mind seeing a Summer Music Games circuit for Marching Band complete with woodwinds....I never marched drum corps, but some of the greatest times of my life have been sitting in the Alamodome getting blown away by pure waves of brass and afterwards turning to my friends and going "Holy Sh**!!! That was AWESOME!!!". I don't want that being twisted by extraneous sound just because people want to hear more interesting music and new colors. I enjoy that kind of thing too, but it has its own place.....it would be great if a comparable level of quality could be introduced to the Outdoor Performance Wind Ensemble....er, marching band. But for now it has its own place.

So they're finally allowing synthesizers and all that mess in..... I LOVE electronics in marching band, I believe the more the better in most cases, but electronics in drum corps is a f***ing disgrace! Drum Corps is like the Olympics, it's fun to watch because it's a triumph of the human spirit, displaying something that took hard work to achieve. The sound of the corps of old was a purely natural sound. Everything that went down on that field was a natural product of human achievement. The hornline sound that rips your face off during a performance all came from the flesh of the lungs and the vibrating of tempered metal. Electronics pervert that sound and pervert that achievement. The sound that comes from Electronics was produced by nothing more than $$$, the object that has robbed many a musician the opportunity to experience something great. Just like in Marching Band, the scores will begin to rely even more on how much money a corps has to fund its electronics, and the artificial textures produced by them will begin to obstruct the natural, unadulterated sound that has made up the drum corps repertoire since the very beginning. If I went to a Houston Symphony concert and found the orchestra director had decided to amplify their strings and resequenced them live so that they'd be louder and have more resonance, I would leave (most of the audience would to). It defiles the art. Marching Band and Drum Corps are governed by 2 very different philosophies. Marching Band is all about fun and about music. Drum Corps is as well, but it's a much more refined art, governed by very strong traditions and worldwide cult followings. Adding Woodwinds to drum corps? Adding electronics to drum corps? It's atrocious! I can't believe people would even CONSIDER it. Ugh! I could keep going and elaborate even further on my points and I don't feel like I got my point across very well, but I know most of you disagree with me, but yeah that's my unadulterated opinion

? Isn't that by Richard Saucedo?

I feel sorry for the Horn players who's band director is a big fan of John Phillip Sousa. Sousa writes some of the worst French Horn parts EVER! 2 new pieces for Sam Houston State Wind Ensemble, a third one to be passed out tomorrow and more to come later on in the semester most likely: La Fiesta Mexicana - Reed Postcards - Ticheli

Wait.....So you like biochemical engineering and politics/government but feel like you'll probably need to become a band director eventually to make money? ..... Let me help give you a little bit of perspective on your life, lol ; ....If there's any way you can help it, DO NOT BECOME A BAND DIRECTOR!!!!!!! Most people teach band either because music is so much a a part of their lives that they feel like they'd be letting themselves down by picking a different career, or because they can't find anything ELSE to pursue as a goal and music is the only thing they really have. Band directors don't make a lot of money at all.....they make ok money (read $30-45,000/yr starting out), but you definitely won't be making as much as you could if you had pursued a career in one of your other choices. If you're torn between music and an actual "lucrative career", go for the more lucrative career....Classical music as a whole is a dying art, kids are getting lazier and harder to teach, arts programs are getting the shaft nationwide (Texas is the only state that's still holding its own, but what about 20 years down the road?), biochemical engineering (ANY kind of engineering for that matter) and government jobs are on the rise....even if you end up teaching some kind of political science (Government, Social Studies etc.) you'll still be better off financially than if you were a band director. Only teach band as a last resort and if you just can't see yourself doing anything else.

First of all I'm a junior in College who's been to 3 TMEA conventions (going to my fourth), and 3 Texas Bandmasters conventions, I'm a graduate of Blinn Junior College and am working towards my Bachelors in Music Ed at SHSU. For Music Education there are 2 schools that really stand out among the rest, and those are University of Houston and Sam Houston State. SHSU has a nationally ranked School of Education program (which is something most of the Texas Universities can't boast) and have one of the highest success rates in the nation in placing teachers in starting school districts. I'm not entirely sure what gives UH their advantage though, I've just always heard numerous people say it's the best for Music Education (I know their academic music programs are very high level and the school as a whole is rather selective), not to mention they're in a geographically strategic location (Top 10 U.S. Metroplex) which gives their student teaching program an incredible advantage due to the school's access to a massive number of public school districts to place their aspiring teachers. A Music Education degree is really nothing more than a B.M (Bachelor's of Music) with Teacher Certification....so you have to spend 3-5 years getting your music degree, then another year to get your teacher certification. So when considering a school, you have to look at both components. And remember where you get your degree from in Texas isn't all that important.....as long as you graduate in Music Ed from a big-name Texas school (and I'll name them: UNT, UT, Tech, UH, Sam, West Texas, Baylor, TCU, A&M Kingsville, Lamar, Texas State, Abilene Christian, UT Arlington, UTD, there's probably a couple more) you're practically guaranteed a job at any decent HS in Texas. But from there your marketability for the higher level (and higher paying!) districts depends on your resume', who you know, what you've done while in school, what have you done since you've left school. Only UNT and UH really stand out on that list, so your degree really says the same no matter where you came from. It's different if you go to school out of state though. I mean the moment the Fine Arts Administrator at 'RichDistrict' ISD looks at your resume' and goes "Oh Sh*t you graduated from Juilliard?!" you can rest assured you got the job (that's a bit of an extreme example since I don't even think Juilliard has a Music Ed program.....but just the name UNT or University of Michigan or University of Indiana carries the air of a "brand name" and WILL give you an edge even if their Music Ed programs aren't as developed as their 'Music Performance' programs). So the degree isn't as important, it's who you know and how impressive your resume' is. To get your Music Ed degree you have to student teach....Over half of graduating music ed majors end up with a full-time position at the school they student-taught at while in their last year of college. You typically get to pick where you student teach so if you know someone in a higher level district who can hook you up with your student teaching you already have a leg up in getting a good job regardless of where you graduated from. If you personally know a band director in Flower Mound or Hurst/Euless/Bedford or Cypress Fairbanks ISD and they can hook you up with your student teaching, then even if they don't have room to hire you upon graduation, you can still apply when they do and the connections you made while student teaching there will give you a HUGE edge in getting a job in 3 of the greatest school districts for band (and in general really) in the nation. However if you have no preference for ST and you allow the university to place you at a school, then regional location of your university becomes important to determining what kind of school you end up teaching at after graduating. The higher you get your first leg up on the ladder, the quicker your trip to the top will be. Opportunities are important too. If you're a good player your playing opportunities you pursue while in college are resume' builders as well, even if you're not a performance major. Houston has a Civic Symphony, multiple community bands, soloist competitions, the Houston Texans Pep Band, The Texas Summer Music Festival Summer Orchestra. If you got to San Antonio there's the San Antonio Symphony, The San Antonio Wind Symphony, The Crossmen Headquarters (Drum Corps experience looks great on a band director job resume', you've received high-level training in the marching arts and are thus, more versatile for their program) among others. The degree isn't that important. Even your GPA isn't that important (unless you graduate with honors, that looks good). Go to a school that has an environment you can take advantage of to further your career. I have a friend who went to Houston Baptist University....not your typical brand name school, the degree he gets from there isn't going to impress anybody. But he was a big fish in a small tank, and while he was there he took advantage of the thriving arts community in Houston, he got to know some bigshots, he played with the Houston Symphonic Band (which is made up of mostly band directors) which got him a good student teaching gig in the Cypress-Fairbanks District, he became his private teacher's principle student at the university which got him gigs at Lakewood Baptist Church (which employs musicians on salary and tenure).....his resume' began to pile up and this netted him a Graduate Teaching Assistantship at SHSU (which means his tuition is completely covered plus they'll pay him to go to grad school!). This assistantship will give him the resume' he needs to become a Wind Ensemble Conductor at the University level! So yeah....go to a school to where you know you can thrive, not one that just gives a "good degree". The degrees all look the same to employers anyway (for the most part with a few exceptions) and Texas has good music schools so it's not like you won't have a job when you get out.

I hate IRC. My first experience with it was 4 years ago when I found that a favorite forum of mine also had an IRC chat community. The community I dealt with was extremely elitist and enjoyed toying around with people who couldn't figure out how to use it. The IRC userbase consists mainly of users that tend to follow big-time subcultural trends (Hardcore gaming, hacking, neomodern social movements, foreign film, indie and obscure music mediums). Because of IRC's powerful filesharing interface (with the same functionality as applications like Limewire and Bittorrent) along with it's channel-based chat interface, it's a useful tool for these people to get access to multimedia that falls into these lines of subculture while at the same time meeting people of similar interest. These people are often social rejects and thus, actually have the FREE TIME to explore these complex applications and figure out how they work and how to use them to their advantage. It was targeted towards these kinds of people and thus, doesn't have to be as user-friendly as AOL, Yahoo or MSN messengers (Which are geared towards the mainstream public). I didn't like the idea of using a network application that was practically invented by hackers. I didn't want my computer to be compromised by some internet terrorist who might be lurking in one of the channels. If this forum wants a chat room I recommend just installing a Java or Flash based application. It's easier and safer that way.

Questions the motives of the monarch in power.