Drum major Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 What band did not make finals that you think should have made finals? That's either a can of worms or a dead horse.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummerjoe Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 What band did not make finals that you think should have made finals? From seeing their show at Area, CT Johnson. Being on the drumline, I can't really tell the difference between a good sound and a great sound for the winds, but their percussion was darn good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaverickBand15 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Well the only part where there is little playing while moving is the drum feature, and that's cause the its a drum feature so therefore the band doesn't play. How much does the band play in the first 30sec to a min of the show Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joeyz Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Round Rock. I saw a streaming of their performance at Area - obviously that's not the saw as seeing it live, but I thought they looked great, and sounded good considering it was on a laptop speaker. I didnt have a chance to see them at state, or live at all, for that matter, so maybe that's not fair to say - but I thought they had a really good show What band did not make finals that you think should have made finals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old sax player Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I though Bowie was incredible all around, and while I adore Marcus, I was rooting for them this year. When I heard Duncanville was third, I actually thinking maybe Bell or Marcus wouldn't medal and Bowie would. Obviously I was quite mistaken on that, but I still enjoyed Bowie far more than the top three. But still, HUGE CONGRATULATIONS to those three bands, they were definitely INCREDIBLE. Great music, impecable marching. And I have a special place in my heart for the LD Bell Color guard - their engery is phenominal Thanks so much for the compliment. This was Bowie's best finish at State ever and we are very proud of them. I thought their show was incredible (but then again, I'm biased) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummerjoe Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 How much does the band play in the first 30sec to a min of the show Haha, never realized that part took so long. Feels like 20 seconds when you're on the field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bchorn Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I was surprised that Brazoswood didn't make the finals. They missed the finals by one spot. What band did not make finals that you think should have made finals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitewing09 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Thanks so much for the compliment. This was Bowie's best finish at State ever and we are very proud of them. I thought their show was incredible (but then again, I'm biased) I definitely agree on thinking their show was incredible. (No association) I think it's the best they've put out on the field in terms of execution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwemlo05 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I don't know if any of you have noticed this yet, but several of the performances from Tuesday night are now up on youtube. I haven't watched them all, but I have to say that as an alum from awhile back, this group is unrecognizable to me as the Bowie Band: http://www.youtube.com/user/twillytomtx#p/u/0/RBTtBpEO31Y Unbelievable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmj Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Here are just a few of my brief thoughts from yesterday: Marcus - AMAZING! Well-deserved winner. Every single detail of this show is performed to perfection. The double-tonguing in the brass, the woodwind technique, the beautiful sonorous ensemble blend, the gorgeous body movement and interval spacing is just out of sight. All while entertaining the heck out of me and making me smile. This is my favorite Marcus show ever (until next year, when I'm sure they'll top this one). I want to be one of the shadow people. Really. Bell - Good luck to them at Indianapolis. As always, they will represent Texas well. I loved that they decided to use the entire warmup as a preshow so that we got to experience the full effect of the show. Yes, it's a different Bell than years past, but it's still amazing Bell. I am a sucker for brass playing backfield while the woodwinds noodle around up front and Bell did this sublimely (not to mention the WW's doing some very hard drill while they are noodling.) Also, the guard really has some beautiful flag work in this show that is 1st rate. I remember 10 years ago, while not bad at all, the guard might have been considered Bell's weakest link. Now, they are one of the bands strongest assets. Hebron - I saw this show at BOA and LOVED it, but seeing it again twice yesterday, I gained an even greater appreciation for it. Those kids are to be commended for pulling off some very technical/very hard music while performing some quite demanding drill. The dynamic contrast, the subtle articulations, the gorgeous woodwind technique are fantastic in Sensemaya and Scythian Suite. Also, major props to the bass line of Hebron. Y'all rock! Loved that the basses got to start the show. But, they truly have some of the best uniformity of individual fundamentals (and marched at quite high tempos, at that). I remember when Hebron was a 4A band, busting in on the finals action at BOA San Antonio several years ago and to see the progression of how far they have come in a short time is a joy to watch. Bowie - Again, fantastic show. They seem to carry of any forte-piano crescendo exceedingly well. That woodwind run in the second movement is just to die for. It goes and on and on and on and never loses intensity and is so beautifully balanced from the flutes to the saxophones. Additionally, hats off to the Bowie trumpets for some insane licks that left me speechless. Really like the set where the trumpet player looks like he's trying pull the giant wheel to move. The Woodlands - Thank you for making me fall in love with Petrushka and Pictures all over again. The easy breezy trumpet solo to start off the show while the band is in a square around the field is the perfect antonym to all of the crazy insane music and marching that follows. Berkner - I liked this show a lot when I saw it at BOA, but they blew me away during their prelims performance! They brought such a confidence and intensity to that run. I had such fun sitting in the upper deck during finals snapping photos of all the different spider/web sets which were marched and spaced meticulously well. Bravo on a fantastic season! Westlake - Their finals run was about 1000 times better than prelims or any performance of it I've seen this season. The block drill all hit so nicely. The solos seemed a bit firmer and I thought their playing of Symphonic Metamorphosis was nicely done. Brazoswood - Wow! Great playing. I know their previous director retired, but they haven't missed a beat! The singing of U2's Vertigo was a nice touch and I can also say that if the job for Marcus shadow is filled, then I will happily be one of the Brazoswood snare drummers that gets strapped to the vertigo wheels and spins around. What fun!!! That was completely unexpected and delightful! Reagan - A bit disappointed that I didn't get to see this again in finals. I just adore that crazy frenetic block move in the Firebird where the band almost starts of in a weird kind of X and then ends up in a rotated diamond. That is very nicely marched (as is everything else). I cannot get enough that amazing oboe sound and the very subtle brass during Vertebrae while the masked marchers entrap the soloist. Again, I am overjoyed that you guys are back! Johnson - I remember watching Churchill and Reagan during Area D 2008 and saying, "you know, North East ISD, just opened another school and I bet we'll see them here kicking butt in 2 years..." Well, sure enough Johnson band you are my new favorite! That prelims performance was crazy good! I swear the guard did not have a single drop of some very tough catches! I loved the band's interpretation of the Barber in the last movement and marching in the final movement, especially the 4-to-5 pass through was truly awesome. The intensity that the performers brought to the music and marching was something to see and their drumline also stuck out to me as being top notch. I cannot wait to see what you do next year! Rowlett - Gorgeous playing of all the requisite pieces of Carnival of the Animals. Each piece seemed to do a nice job of telling the story and the guard accompanied with the animal flags very nicely. Haltom - Yes, there might have been some timing issues, but overall they pulled off the finest rendition of Shostakovich No. 10 that I have ever heard on the marching field. Bravo! Round Rock - So nice to see them have a very good perfomance. Incredible drumline and gorgeous flutes! Anderson - Equally impressed with them. This band has come a LONG way in a just a few short years. All of the colors and drama brought by the color guard only enhanced this already wonderfully played show. Really great woodwind licks and some nice low brass playing throughout. Langham Creek - I loved how All Creatures of Our God and King kept popping up as a recurring them in their show. Beautiful woodwind clarity in this band. Pearland - Fun show. All of the jester props were neat and I was thrilled when the music turned dark that they turned them around and his face was a skull. I particularly enjoyed the flute and piccolo solos in this show. Also, Dance of the Jester's was great fun! Although the program said it was by Rimsky-Korsakov for some odd reason. No, Rimsky did Dance of the Tumblers. Jesters is Tchaikovsky. All in all, a great show! I have attended every 5A State Marching Contest since 1998 and I must say that yesterday's was the finest one that I have seen since the epic year that was 2000. If we have any splits and wide discrepancies in the judging - it's because every band is just that good. Seriously, all bands should be proud of what they achieved in just reaching the state marching contest, no matter the result. You each represented your Areas well. I am proud to be a citizen of the great state of Texas, where we absolutely have the finest marching bands in the nation. God Bless Texas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrwood69 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Personally, I think complaining about judging inconsistencies is nonsensical. It just depends on what the judge is looking at druing a particular part of your show, or just in general. Say side 1 of your field in generally very clean, which the drill on side 2 has serious interval and geometrical problems. If a judge is more focused on side 1, you'll get a significantly higher score from them than from the judge focusing on side 2. Similarly, if one judge values form shape far over individual technique, the score could again be significantly different than one who values them inversely. The same logic applies to musical judges. One might value tone quality most, while another thinks articulation accuracy matters far more. It makes no sense to complain about it - you have to be excellent in every aspect to please those judges, and if you're not, you can count on atleast one of them to catch it. Some people might say it causes faulty inconsistencies, but I think it merely serves to cover all the bases better. I do understand the nature of a multijudge system, however it is very unlikely that for several performances, all the judges only see one of the two different extremes of the shows (the good and bad). At the same time, I don't think your reasoning explains that there also tends to be a judge that is just a consistent problem throughout the board giving bands scores that put them in the opposite half of the list than the others. And that's what I'm trying to get at: what judge's "value". That shouldn't be happening. Every judge should be trained according to the standards in which the organization is setting. I mean, when is the last time people complained about BOA recaps, or DCI? No one ever sees the kinds of problems there like they do in UIL recaps. Why? Because those problems don't exist! The only time people complain about judging is when talking about UIL. It makes perfect sense to complain about it. Apparently 2/3 of the music judges in prelims thought Coppell sounded the 2nd best... the other thought 17th, so I don't believe it's just about being excellent in every area, because frankly, in no area of Coppell's music were they the 17th best. The problem UIL has is that they provide absolutely no science for their judges to go by, plain and simple. It needs to be fixed, because these judges are put in the most awkward situations afterwards when they see how incredibly different they were. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenon Posted November 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I have attended every 5A State Marching Contest since 1998 and I must say that yesterday's was the finest one that I have seen since the epic year that was 2000. I agree completely! And 2000 was epic beyond all belief! Westfield's brain show, Churchill's jungle gym, The Colony's Ghost Train, Duncanville's powder cannons, Spring's techno breakdown, Spring's rushing the stands to close, Berkner's massive tarp, Leander's lake tarps and Flight of the Bumblebee, Langham Creek being added as an 8th Finalist thanks to the Bad Judge Rule, and Bell earning the Triple Crown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummerjoe Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I do understand the nature of a multijudge system, however it is very unlikely that for several performances, all the judges only see one of the two different extremes of the shows (the good and bad). At the same time, I don't think your reasoning explains that there also tends to be a judge that is just a consistent problem throughout the board giving bands scores that put them in the opposite half of the list than the others. And that's what I'm trying to get at: what judge's "value". That shouldn't be happening. Every judge should be trained according to the standards in which the organization is setting. I mean, when is the last time people complained about BOA recaps, or DCI? No one ever sees the kinds of problems there like they do in UIL recaps. Why? Because those problems don't exist! The only time people complain about judging is when talking about UIL. It makes perfect sense to complain about it. Apparently 2/3 of the music judges in prelims thought Coppell sounded the 2nd best... the other thought 17th, so I don't believe it's just about being excellent in every area, because frankly, in no area of Coppell's music were they the 17th best. The problem UIL has is that they provide absolutely no science for their judges to go by, plain and simple. It needs to be fixed, because these judges are put in the most awkward situations afterwards when they see how incredibly different they were. Wow, mrwood69, that is an amazing answer. This response is nothing less than flawless. You must have a lot of common sense. I bet you are very well educated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrwood69 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 (edited) Edited November 6, 2011 by mrwood69 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longhorn2190 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I agree completely! And 2000 was epic beyond all belief! and Bell earning the Triple Crown. What do you mean by this? Wasn't 2000 Bell's first state championship? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenon Posted November 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 What do you mean by this? Wasn't 2000 Bell's first state championship? They won BOA Houston, BOA San Antonio, and State. Back then, those were the three major competitions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummerjoe Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 And I bet you have a blonde girlfriend, a sister in college, a younger brother, two parents, live in a neighborhood off of 3406 and have a goldfish carrier that looks like a goldfish. I bet you're about to date a blonde, have a sister in high school and middle school, two parents, also live in a neighborhood off of 3406 and have lanyard for your keys that displays your adoration of the Patriots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrwood69 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 (edited) I bet you're about to date a blonde, have a sister in high school and middle school, two parents, also live in a neighborhood off of 3406 and have lanyard for your keys that displays your adoration of the Patriots. Uhhh no. Edited November 6, 2011 by mrwood69 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centex_band_mom Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I am a parent who's very new to marching band so I don't know what the various judging points are. I happened to like Johnson (SA) and I think someone said they were surprised they didn't make finals. My daughter happened to point to the time that expired (at 01 seconds) in the State prelim and they were still finishing up. I have to wonder if this cost them valuable points/votes? Strange thing is they didn't start Woodlands clock until 20-30 seconds into the program (after drum major acknowledged and they then started) and they ended with 16 seconds on the clock (so should have run out of time too). Maybe it's not a big deal though. I did notice a few strange things that I wonder if you seasoned band folks can answer. I saw several bands with people directing that were not drum majors (older people with badges, not uniforms). Is that okay? We also saw some adults telling the kids on the electronic equipment when to push what button - seemed strange. Also with Duncanville, I saw a snare drum not playing (no sticks in the hands even), but with no noticeable cast/sling, etc. Is that okay to march someone who is obviously not playing? Finally, one of the Duncanville staff (with a backpack, etc.) and two colorgard were picking up flags on the field to the right and the back of the field, during the last 1-2 minutes of the show. Is that okay? I've just never seen that in the few competitions I've been to this year. I appreciate all the coverage on this site of BOA and State. I think our band is great, but there are a lot of truly great bands and I know they all work as hard as we do. A lot for parents to be proud of!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummerdad Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I mean if i am being nit picky compared to other schools RR doesn't do as much playing while moving and their drill isn't filled with lines and has lot of follow the leader sets. RR also has a lot of large chunks of percussion break where the band pulls out fans, and they use alot of synthesizer. So i think when you dont play and march as much and your drill is not as hard but your show is super entertaining i would personally have a hard time giving a high musical or visual score. I would give RR huge percussion and visual effect scores. Where as some judges will say it doesn't matter how difficult it is and how much playing is actually it's clean and played well so they will give RR high visual and music scores...and that is where the split judging. But RR cant blame the judges because they should have known designing a show like that would take those risks. Either way RR does what they like to do in an awesome fashon and should be proud of where they got. Yes, Yes, Yes...I support a band that has a very similiar approach to their show design as RR, and it played very well at regional contests and BOA, but they got chewed up this year at Area. These shows look great, sound great, and get great crowd response, but you have to refer back to the UIL Area and State marching rubrics to understand where these judges are coming from. http://www.uiltexas.org/files/music/area-m...-descriptor.pdf http://www.uiltexas.org/files/music/area-m...-descriptor.pdf Though there are examples of inconsistent judging at UIL, I tend to view the bigger challenge to a program to be designing a show that both meets UIL Rubrics and can play well to a crowd with all the GE and accessory participation that creates success at BOA and most regional competitions. Haltom's show, as an example, had all the elements covered in the UIL Rubrics, almost to a science, and the music was compelling and well played. But I would not say it met as high of a standard in terms of GE, use of guard, percussion and field presentation, which was evident in how they ranked at San Antonio BOA. If I were a judge coming into this state to judge UIL, and was handed these Rubrics, I would probably watch a band like RR and say..."great show, really like the execution, love that the crowd responded...but there are some critical elements missing according to the Rubrics. Consider this element in the UIL State music rubrics: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitewing09 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I do understand the nature of a multijudge system, however it is very unlikely that for several performances, all the judges only see one of the two different extremes of the shows (the good and bad). At the same time, I don't think your reasoning explains that there also tends to be a judge that is just a consistent problem throughout the board giving bands scores that put them in the opposite half of the list than the others. And that's what I'm trying to get at: what judge's "value". That shouldn't be happening. Every judge should be trained according to the standards in which the organization is setting. I mean, when is the last time people complained about BOA recaps, or DCI? No one ever sees the kinds of problems there like they do in UIL recaps. Why? Because those problems don't exist! The only time people complain about judging is when talking about UIL. It makes perfect sense to complain about it. Apparently 2/3 of the music judges in prelims thought Coppell sounded the 2nd best... the other thought 17th, so I don't believe it's just about being excellent in every area, because frankly, in no area of Coppell's music were they the 17th best. The problem UIL has is that they provide absolutely no science for their judges to go by, plain and simple. It needs to be fixed, because these judges are put in the most awkward situations afterwards when they see how incredibly different they were. I think that some of the complaining is because of how the scores are presented. UIL presents which ordinal rankings judges give, while BOA presents a value. What if the UIL judges raw scores were extreme close together, but since the information is present as ordinal, it doesn't show that maybe the judge thought that Coppell's show was excellent but they thought that there were other shows that were a little better. Aren't BOA judges more specific. Like a judge for ensemble sound, individual sound, ensemble marching, individual marching? UIL doesn't have this. We can't say that they need to be trained to think more similarly because they might think similarly, but they happen to notice different discrepancies in the show. I think UIL should stay the same. It adds a little spice to our lives. It's cool to see different bands scoring differently at UIL and BOA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chs31 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Can anyone explain how Coppell got a 17 in prelims in Music? That one really makes no sense at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TxRaider13 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I am a parent who's very new to marching band so I don't know what the various judging points are. I happened to like Johnson (SA) and I think someone said they were surprised they didn't make finals. My daughter happened to point to the time that expired (at 01 seconds) in the State prelim and they were still finishing up. I have to wonder if this cost them valuable points/votes? Strange thing is they didn't start Woodlands clock until 20-30 seconds into the program (after drum major acknowledged and they then started) and they ended with 16 seconds on the clock (so should have run out of time too). Maybe it's not a big deal though. I did notice a few strange things that I wonder if you seasoned band folks can answer. I saw several bands with people directing that were not drum majors (older people with badges, not uniforms). Is that okay? We also saw some adults telling the kids on the electronic equipment when to push what button - seemed strange. Also with Duncanville, I saw a snare drum not playing (no sticks in the hands even), but with no noticeable cast/sling, etc. Is that okay to march someone who is obviously not playing? Finally, one of the Duncanville staff (with a backpack, etc.) and two colorgard were picking up flags on the field to the right and the back of the field, during the last 1-2 minutes of the show. Is that okay? I've just never seen that in the few competitions I've been to this year. I appreciate all the coverage on this site of BOA and State. I think our band is great, but there are a lot of truly great bands and I know they all work as hard as we do. A lot for parents to be proud of!!! I can't answer the clock problems, but I know a little about the rest. You can have a director conduct, theirs no rule against that. Students can pick up flags after use on the field, I think most of the schools at area C do this, and I know for fact Poteet and Forney do this. Umm a parent/director helping out on electronics is something I don't know to much about, but I do know the student has to be the one working it but I don't think it is a penalty when a parent tells them when, Berkner did this at Area and I thought the same thing. Their is always some one marching and not playing, maybe the drummer lost his sticks at a bad time, and some wind players will look like their playing, but really aren't. Ex: At Poteet we had woodwinds marching brass b/c people got hurt/sick/failed. Sorry I don't know the clock rules and problems, but if I had to guess I bet they have a person in the press box who actually keeps time just incase the stadium clock doesn't work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chs31 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Can anyone explain how Coppell got a 17 in prelims in Music? That one really makes no sense at all. Just notice the same judge gave 15th place Haltom a 2.... nothing against Haltom just not sure they were a 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chs31 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Just notice the same judge gave 15th place Haltom a 2.... nothing against Haltom just not sure they were a 2 Same judge had 19th Keller ranked higher then LD BELL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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