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2021 6A UIL SMBC (Nov. 8 & 9)


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First and foremost congratulations to Hebron, very VERY well deserved, and what I'm about to say is not to take away from their victory or any bands placement tonight. However, I need someone to help me understand the inconsistencies between judging panels at UIL. BOA is far from perfect, but they at least seem to be more consistent over their competitions. There is no doubt that bands have good runs and bad runs and that a lot of progress can be made within even just a week, but it seems a large portion of UIL is just a crapshoot with what judges you get. Again, I know that BOA, and all judged events for that matter, have a similar fatal flaw, but UIL just seems to suffer from it worse than most. Look at vista ridge over vandy or ctj over reagan from the Area competitions or look at BOASA from this past weekend (an event that UIL is trying to judge more like) yet you have CTJ dropping to 8th while just the other day taking bronze at BOASA. (again they are 2 separate competitions and judged differently, but you can't convince me Jarrett Lipman didn't piss in the judges cheerios over the weekend)

Jokes aside, I really am curious as to why UIL suffers so much more from discrepancies compared to other judged events, so please, enlighten me fellow band nerds :) 

 

 

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16 minutes ago, BandFan59 said:

Flower Mound's percussion scores were what knocked them down below Marcus. There was an ordinal gap of 10 in that caption alone, while overall they were separated by an ordinal gap of 5. I think they will be just fine for Grand Nationals.

Yeah I agree idk how it was that low but could definitely see them too 3 at Nats. Maybe ever Marcus? It’s gonna be one heck of a competition is all I know 

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26 minutes ago, Ants_VS_Cotton Balls said:

First and foremost congratulations to Hebron, very VERY well deserved, and what I'm about to say is not to take away from their victory or any bands placement tonight. However, I need someone to help me understand the inconsistencies between judging panels at UIL. BOA is far from perfect, but they at least seem to be more consistent over their competitions. There is no doubt that bands have good runs and bad runs and that a lot of progress can be made within even just a week, but it seems a large portion of UIL is just a crapshoot with what judges you get. Again, I know that BOA, and all judged events for that matter, have a similar fatal flaw, but UIL just seems to suffer from it worse than most. Look at vista ridge over vandy or ctj over reagan from the Area competitions or look at BOASA from this past weekend (an event that UIL is trying to judge more like) yet you have CTJ dropping to 8th while just the other day taking bronze at BOASA. (again they are 2 separate competitions and judged differently, but you can't convince me Jarrett Lipman didn't piss in the judges cheerios over the weekend)

Jokes aside, I really am curious as to why UIL suffers so much more from discrepancies compared to other judged events, so please, enlighten me fellow band nerds :) 

 

 

UIL's ordinal judging probably contributes to that. It's not a great system and I really wish they would just switch to raw scores like BOA does, but I don't think it'll happen any time soon.

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13 minutes ago, BandFan59 said:

UIL's ordinal judging probably contributes to that. It's not a great system and I really wish they would just switch to raw scores like BOA does, but I don't think it'll happen any time soon.

I asked this same question for 5A state finals in the thread. 

I forget the user but he went through and made it clear, raw scores vs ordinals was not different much, if at all.

Would love to do that for this contest but idk where to find the raw scores

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33 minutes ago, BandFan59 said:

UIL's ordinal judging probably contributes to that. It's not a great system and I really wish they would just switch to raw scores like BOA does, but I don't think it'll happen any time soon.

oh for the love of God no .. BOA is the absolute worst. Please do not tarnish UIL with BOA 

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6 minutes ago, BandDad4 said:

Disregards what in particular? If we are talking about the props and the pageantry. I'd say that is a good thing.

Reagan broke the record at boa San Antonio without any props, I don’t think at any event props play a major factor in scoring as you know, marching fundamentals and music are sorta important

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10 minutes ago, BandDad4 said:

Disregards what in particular? If we are talking about the props and the pageantry. I'd say that is a good thing.

This isn’t some 70s, 80s, 90s drums and bugle corps we are watching these days. It’s the marching arts. The pageantry absolutely shouldn’t be disregarded. Props… idk. Not every district can afford a drum corps turning platform. But that’s why I said they BOTH have flaws. BOA judges to much effect and I think UIL doesn’t judge enough. The effect disregarded out of CTJ and flower mound is unfortunate. Getting a high school boy that isn’t in theatre to portray a happy theme isn’t easy. The kids are clearly bought in. 

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4 minutes ago, banddad84 said:

Every program has the ability to opt out of BOA - with UIL, not so much.

the UIL scoring process is a known antiquated hot mess. this year was going to be different with a 7 judge panel that would reward both guard and percussion. it was trialed in 5A State in 2019 with shadow judges to see how it went and was not done in 2020 due to the pandemic. It was again a hot mess that had no consistency with very wide swings from prelims and finals and no understanding to how the judging was done.

BOA is far from perfect, but you know what to expect.

I do think the new system is much better then what it was before. 
 

I tend to believe the inconsistencies came from the fact most of the panel changes between prelims and finals rather then a “flawed” system. Different judges have different ideas for what they like to listen for or see. 
 

I don’t know if there is/was training for these contests but this is the first use of this system. I expected some interesting results. 
 

But it cannot be horribly flawed considering they, in most peoples eyes and ears, got the top 2 correct in prelims and finals.

 

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