NETexasBandFan

They could, as mentioned previously in another thread, UIL prevents sports from participating in non UIL circuits in place of UIL. It's very concerning. The main reason I can see most school districts justifying forcing their bands to go to UIL area over BOA SA is about Lone Star Cup points, otherwise I think school districts would prefer BOA because of how high-profile it is, but the Lone Star Cup is a big deal to many schools and band can bring some major points to help a school win.

I wish every year area could work right, it would be so beneficial so bands that can't/don't do BOA. All area contests shouldn't be on the same day in order to help with judging, but scheduling off year areas on the weekend of BOA San Antonio is not the way to go. From what I understand though, UIL itself still has to decide how and if to implement it.

I see a very major issue with changing the judging sheets for state but not area, as the passed proposal suggested, that would give area and state different judging formats, which could make the rankings between those 2 rounds very different. Just doesn't make sense to me, although I love the new state sheets. Also, it may not have the numbers for it just yet (As far as the number of bands at area and state contests), but 5A could really use a D2 and D1 as well if a 6A one were to be implemented. 5A has by far the biggest split in skill between the D1 and D2 sized schools as far as band goes. But one thing at a time, if it's to be implemented, it should probably be piloted with just 6A.

At TBA last Wednesday, UIL voted on several new music rules, including things such as every year area, adjusting sightreading levels for Sub-NV bands, and regional state s&e contests. Has anyone heard any word on what the outcome of this voting was? Also a thread for discussing these changes, there's lots of interesting things in here. Some more controversial like Every Year Area, others I think make perfect sense like making it so Sub-NV bands read easier sightreading levels than NV Bands. https://www.uiltexas.org/files/music/MAC_Agenda_July_2019.pdf

I would hope UIL would never make a move like that, especially the 2nd one, it would anger more than just BOA programs. Lots of military bands skip area, lots of show bands don't do UIL at all and focus on their "Battle of The Bands" competitions, and some rural programs attempting to build will attend non-UIL invitationals for a couple years until the directors feel the program is ready to try their hand at actual UIL. (Though I would assume that rule doesn't apply to non-circuit based competitions, which is why lots of schools host sports tournaments that aren't UIL sponsored)

My apologies, I didn't mean to come off as rude saying "Whether you like it or not". But I do think you're right and we can all agree, give the programs a choice. It's a touchy subject, host it on the BOA SA weekend, lots of bands may lose that choice thanks to their school districts, host it on the regular area weekend, you create issues finding enough judges and venues (Especially since lots of band directors who would usually judge area are now taking their bands to area too). I'm sure there's a way to work it out having it all on the same weekend though, I think even for non-BOA bands, pushing area to November is somewhat ridiculous, lots of bands want to be done before November. I love both UIL and BOA, and I want UIL to have this to give more groups opportunities, but UIL should try it's best to not conflict with BOA events, especially such hugely popular events like SA.

Texas bands wouldn't be where they are today without UIL, and UIL would probably be a lot more popular if they did a better job at hosting yearly contests, better judging systems, and started this every year area thing MUCH earlier. Having a state-sponsored marching contest gives school districts reasons to fund band programs now that their state's main circuit is now giving them a competition outlet, especially in UIL where the Lone Star cup gives schools motivation to make sure all their programs are successful. Take a look at Arkansas for example, they just started a SMC in 2016, and I personally think the quality of bands there has significantly increased in that short period of time. Here's my thoughts about every year area- Whether you like it or not, the majority of bands in Texas are NOT focused on Bands of America, and this would give them a great outlet to have an end of the year championship that'll again encourage schools to greater support the band program. Although, I HIGHLY disagree with scheduling it on the same as BOA SA, that would just cause a lot of 6A and even some 5A Area contests to just be full of skips, not only that, but since it's a UIL event, some school districts might force their bands to attend area over BOA SA, and I think that's unfair and bands should be given the choice. I'm not a band director, but if I was and my band was BOA focused, I would choose SA, if it was not for whatever reason, I would choose area, but sadly my school district may not give me this choice. This would also probably upset a lot of students and parents who were looking forward to BOA SA. Scheduling all Area contests on the same day on the other hand, although makes the most sense scheduling wise, you have to think about the judging situation so many of us are already complaining about. Having what would be a whopping 33 contests to host, which would make finding qualified judges an issue. That's 165 judges to hire, and that's under the assumption the judging doesn't change and we don't add more judges to 5A/6A Area Contests like as planned with state currently. Potentially, although VERY VERY unlikely, maybe we could turn the every year area idea into a UIL sponsored "Regional" championship, similar to area, but combining certain areas to have a larger competition, especially since a lot of bands will skip for BOA anyway. For example, we could combine 6A Areas B and C into one "DFW" championship, this would make up for the massive amount of bands who would skip, and I doubt many bands would mind a bit of extra travel for this. For 2A-4A, and maybe even 5A, we can probably just leave it the same, especially given what huge distances small school areas cover already. This idea probably wouldn't ever happen though, and I'm sure someone here can think of a good argument as to why it's not a viable idea.

Canton is a bit debatable on being in the DFW, but probably more than close enough

This area will definitely be dominated by Frisco programs for finals spots, Lebanon Trail getting 2nd at 4A honor band to North Lamar, despite I'm pretty sure not even having juniors that year, is INSANELY impressive. With what should be their first full senior class in 2019, they'll be a force to be reckoned with. Princeton is an interesting mix, if it was almost any another area I'd have them in for area finals and even state in quite a few, but Area B is so insane it's unknown how they will stack up, but I'm sure the kids are working harder than ever to make up for the adjustment, so they could fall into area finals possibly, state is a long shot but not impossible. I believe their enrollment is consistently getting bigger though, and they already had a 200 person band program in 4A with somewhere around 1100 kids. That's almost 1/5 of the kids in school in band, so if that ratio stays (which it usually doesn't when schools get bigger due to several factors, but that wouldn't hurt them. Smaller schools are just known for having much higher band participation ratios imo), so with an ever growing enrollment that group could get huge and much more skilled.

I don't think it was their first time, definitely the first in a very long time but they made it once or twice in the late 80s or early 90s I believe. They would've had way more opportunities had they not spent most of their history in 5A. Still really happy for them, loved their 2016 show and was dissapointed to see how close they were.

The issue with that is asking the judge to judge the band as a whole is a lot to ask out of them, watching 41 bands a day focusing on one aspect is tough enough, and you're bound to lose focus or make some mistakes in judgement already. Forcing judges to analyze every aspect of the band would only make spreads wrose and judging less accurate. It works for region because you're only being judged to see if you meet a standard, but at area/state the split in music and marching is necessary.

Adding onto what Jeffrey said about what if the lowest and highest score were the same category, what if you added 2 judges to both panels and then dropped the lowes and highest score on each panel? My only issue I can see why that is just that dropping 4 out of 11 judges scores seems ridiculous, and that's a lot of judges to hire, especially at the area level. I also believe UIL should stop allowing areas to hire their own judges, area is usually where spreads and arguable bias is the worse, and I'm sure the fact that areas pick their own judges, sometimes the same ones year after year, contributes to that.

All conferences have this issue to an extent, except 1A because there's no area, but I was pointing out a hypothetical but likely situation that would be the peak of this problem. I believe the top 3 most overly difficult areas as of now are 6A Area B, 3A Area C, and 4A Area B. 6A Area H is an honorable mention but there's a pretty big gap between the 4 that ended up going to state out of that area and everyone else. I do like how this topic is starting to become about UIL alignment balance in general, it gets you thinking a lot

The thing about the cutoffs is that they seem to bring them around full cycle before adding another A, 1A now would probably have to come around full cycle to around what it equaled in 2012 before they added 6A in 2014, which basically split 1A into 1A and 2A and bumped everything else up an A. 2012 looked like this, so, let's say it comes quickly full cycle by 2022. 5A 2090 & up 4A 1005-2089 3A 450-1004 2A 200-449 1A 199 & below 2022 would look like this, and 2024 would split 1A back in half and simply bump everyone up 6A 3500+? (I would actually estimate 5A 2090-199 4A 1005-2089 3A 450-1004 2A 200-449 1A 199 & below Because of this cycle, there WILL be a point where the 3A cutoff hits a zone that will create that super area I theorized, assuming those schools don't exponentially grow or shrink. Within 2-4 more alignments it would start sorting itself out though, sending smaller school bands down to 2A. The issue with this is how close these schools are, every single one I mentioned are in Region 4. Atlanta, Queen City, Pleasant Grove, Liberty-Eylau, New Boston, and Redwater are within the same 2 neighboring counties. There could be hope to realign out Mineola, Winnsboro, and perhaps White Oak into a new area, the thing is Region 3 of Area B is right next door to the east, holding Canton, Wills Point, and Famersville, who are all small enough to move down to 3A in this same theorized situation. (And 3A Area B also contributes entirely state finalists too I believe)

For those of you who don't know, UIL 3A Area C is an insanely hard area. All 4 bands from there made state finals, placing 1st, 4th, 6th, and 8th respectively. There's 3 or 4 other bands in this area that would have a shot at the state finals, and a consistent 4A state finalist, Atlanta, was moved into this area this past alignment. The question is, as UIL keeps pushing the bottom limit of the cutoffs up, what happens as more good 4As like Atlanta move down? http://realignment.uiltexas.org/alignments/2018/4-Reclassification_Data.pdf This document right here shows how the bottom cutoffs are slowly going to come full circle now that UIL added 6A, odds are eventually 4A now could become the same cutoffs as it was in the late 80s or even all the way to what it was the year before 6A was added. Take the 1994 3A cutoff for example, 295 to 714 kids. This would keep all of the following: Mineola Queen City New Diana New Boston Winnsboro Redwater Atlanta All of these bands but 1 have been to state finals before, 2 of them have won state championships, 2 more have metaled, all of them were considered potentially state finalist worthy in 2017 (It would remove Omaha Pewitt into 2A) But, it also adds: Spring Hill (current 4A state finalist) Pleasant Grove Liberty-Eylau Gilmer Pittsburg The first 4 bands were 2nd, 6th, 10th, 11th at 4A Area C this year respectively. 3 of them have been to state finals before. Imagine what they could do in 3A. If all these programs remain strong, this 3A area could become a brutal nightmare. But that won't happen for MANY years, and a lot changes in decades, back when these cutoffs were the same most of these schools were infact in 3A together, just not nearly as strong, it's just a thought to entertain the mind .